Vistula - meaning of word
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Vistula



removing the irrelevant mention of Prussians from the paragraph on the Ukraine: 'The Gothic historian Jordanis (550 AD) wrote about the Aesti-Prussi and a Bajuvarian historian in 850 AD wrote about the Brus.'. Note, it should be Ostrogothic, Jordanes, and Bavarian. :How come German name of the river is important here? Also, User:Johan Magnus in his [http://en.wikipedia.org/w/wiki.phtml?title=Vistula&diff=0&oldid=7743990 recent edits] insist on mentioning the German name and explains it with Wikipedia:Naming conventions. May I ask which of the conventions does he mean? :Also, I understand that generations of Germans, Norwegians, Swedes and so on knew the river under its Germanic name, but it was never used in English and if we mention the Germanic name, we should also list all other alternative names, ranging from French to Russian and from Finnish to Swaheli. What's the fuzz all about here? User:Halibutt 08:51, Nov 22, 2004 (UTC) Also, in case we wanted to add the alternative names: here's a list of names to be included: * German: Weichsel, Wissel, Wixel, Wyxel * Dutch, Norwegian: Weichsel * Polish: Wisła * French: Vistule * Spanish, Latin: Vistula * Italian: Vistola * Portugese: Vístula * Russian, Bulgarian: Висла (Visla) * Czech, Slovak, Slovenian: Visla * Esperanto: Vistulo I will add more this evening. User:Halibutt">User:Halibutt|User:Halibutt 09:18, Nov 22, 2004 (UTC) :I'm sorry but you are mistaken; You don't have to go to other Germanic languages to see the name of the river spelled ''Weichsel;'' you find it in qualified scientifical works by native Englishmen and also on maps. It's the ''French'' who called the river for ''Vistule.'' The matter is Wikipedia's usability. For readers who have not yet learned the new name on the river, there is reason to affirm that ''Vistula'' and ''Weichsel'' really are different names for the same river. :I'm afraid Emax' conviction is easy to (mis-) interpret as a tendency to decide first and then only see that part of reality that supports one's chosen view, which is maybe comprehensible, but nevertheless unlucky both for them affected and for the Wikipedia as such. :I guess some Wikipedians might remember that I already before have reacted against the perception that a name that is common in several (neighbouring) languages has to be marked as "German". This isn't really the central point here, or oughtn't be at least. Neither do I hold long lists of names in other languages than English for a good idea. But I think it would be good for all parts if the ''English'' usage could be recognized in the introduction. The river is, after all, one of the more important on the European continent. --User:Johan Magnus 13:02, 22 Nov 2004 (UTC) ::I'm sorry, but I'd have to see a proof. I did a quick Google search and there are indeed lots of English language links referring to Weichsel, but I have yet to see a link referring to the river and not some surname or nick-name. I'm currently on page 5 and I've seen some four links, two of them referring to [http://www.britannica.com/eb/print?tocId=9076434 Vistula Glacial Stage] on Brittanica], one to an English version of web page of some German engineering company and one linking a site with translations of German WWII propaganda pictures. Perhaps you could post some proof that the river is referred to with its German name in English. (Compare [http://www.google.pl/search?as_q=Vistula&num=10&hl=pl&client=firefox-a&rls=org.mozilla%3Apl-PL%3Aofficial&btnG=Szukaj+z+Google&as_epq=&as_oq=&as_eq=&lr=lang_en&as_ft=i&as_filetype=&as_qdr=all&as_occt=any&as_dt=i&as_sitesearch=] with [http://www.google.pl/search?q=Weichsel&hl=pl&lr=lang_en&client=firefox-a&rls=org.mozilla:pl-PL:official&as_qdr=all&start=0&sa=N]). ::Also, you are mistaken that the English name was coined after the French usage. As a matter of fact both the French and the English names come from Latin and it was the Latin name that was in use for ages. The English/Latin name was used on all English maps I've ever seen (including those of 17th century) except for several maps showing German WWI and WWII operations, which use simply the German staff maps. I have yet to see an English map that would use the German name. Could you post some reference? User:Halibutt">User:Halibutt|User:Halibutt 14:19, Nov 22, 2004 (UTC) :::If we stay at the Google test stage (printed books would of course be good, but for someone who has left university ages ago, and don't live in a town with a university library, serious books in foreign languages aren't too easy to get one's hands on any more), searching for weichsel-river OR river-weichsel[http://www.google.com/search?hl=en&lr=lang_en&as_qdr=all&q=weichsel-river+OR+river-weichsel], we get of course plenty of translations from German. But also, as number four in my search, a hit for the journal ''Nature,'' a footnote actually, that of course might be due to a lesser educated translator, but doesn't that journal have some standards to live up to? As number six on my searchlist is the mapsite http://www.ontopia.net/. and as number seven a book review at Jerusalem Post. At the ''World Socialist Web Site'' I'm stunned. I've always considered it a leftist position to be very eager to change geographical names in high pace, but here reports from Poland speaks of ''River Weichsel.'' Then there are, of course tons (well, all in all two magnitudes less than for river-vistula) of references to sacrifices during the World Wars, and I don't really see why people who are curious about a river of importance for their ancestors should not be given appropriate guidance. --User:Johan Magnus 16:34, 22 Nov 2004 (UTC) ::Of course the people should know that the river is called with several names in different languages, but I still do not understand why the German name is more important that French or Russian. Perhaps we could add a new ==Names== chapter with all the names? ::As to the links - I'd still have to find a proof. The "[http://66.102.9.104/search?q=cache:A6Cv52NqCCkJ:www.nature.com/nature/journal/v419/n6906/extref/419447a-s2.doc+weichsel-river+OR+river-weichsel+Nature&hl=en&lr=lang_en Nature]" link is a list of specimens in some institute in Berlin. No wonder they used the German name. I think that the Israeli link might use Weichsel consistently because that might be the Yiddish name of the river. Also, the story tells the tale of a daughter of German concentration camp commandant. No wonder what she remembered was the German name of the river. And so on, and so forth. I see that the name appears on some web pages, but to me it seems that it is used here and there accidentally, either due to bad translation or no translation at all. User:Halibutt">User:Halibutt|User:Halibutt 18:30, Nov 22, 2004 (UTC) Excuse me, but isn't the point that readers of English texts might find the name Weichsel, and would need instant confirmation that this really is the right article? If that is due to bad translations or old books or due to something else, isn't that rather irrelevant? Another, surely valid, support for including the name ''Weichsel'' exactly one time, and that in the first sentence, is that nobody speaks of the ''Vistula glaciation'' — it's known as the ''Weichsel glaciation,'' or ''The Last Ice Age,'' in Europe and as the ''Wisconsin glaciation'' in the US, I believe. /User:Tuomas 22:31, 22 Nov 2004 (UTC) : Perhaps apart from [http://www.britannica.com/eb/article?tocId=9076434&query=Weichsel&ct= Britannica] that uses both names and [http://encarta.msn.com/encnet/refpages/search.aspx?q=Vistula+glaciation&Submit2=Go Encarta] that offers a redirect from "Vistula glaciation" to Glacier and Vistula, but does not mention "Weichsel glaciation". However, Google search shows much more links to Weichsel glaciation than to Vistula glaciation (some 4:1). So, all in all, I believe that there should be a link to Vistula on the Weichsel glaciation page. However, I still see no need to add the German name to this article. Or at least no need to add it if other alternative names are omitted. :Other thing is that no readers would be mistaken since currently no articles lead to the article on Vistula through the Weichsel redirect. User:Halibutt">User:Halibutt|User:Halibutt 00:21, Nov 23, 2004 (UTC)

Vistula



Vistula (Polish language ''Wisła'', German language ''Weichsel'') is the longest river in Poland. It is 1,047 kilometers (678 miles) long and drains about 192,000 square kilometers (74,000 sq. miles), or almost two thirds of Poland's surface. The Vistula has its source in the south of the country, at Barania Gora (1220m high) in the Beskidy Mountains where it starts with White Little Vistula (''Biała Wisełka'') and Black Little Vistula (''Czarna Wisełka''). It then continues to flow over the vast Polish plains, passing several large Polish cities along its way, including Cracow, Sandomierz, Warsaw, Plock, Wloclawek, Torun, Swiecie, Tczew and Gdansk. With a river delta and several branches (Leniwka, Przekop, Smiala Wisla, Martwa Wisla, Nogat and Szkarpawa) it empties into the Vistula Lagoon and Gdansk Bay of the Baltic Sea. ==History== It is not known whether the name Vistula is Indo-European or pre-Indo-European. The name was first recorded by Tacitus in AD 98 in his ''Germania (book)''. During that time the Vistula River ran into the Mare Suebicum, which was later called Baltic Sea. According to him, near the delta lived the East Germanic tribes of the Suebi and Burgundians, on both banks the Goths (see also Gothiscandza and Wielbark culture) and east of them the Aesti, Galindi, Sudauer, Borusci, Venedes, and more. There he described people on the most eastern part of the Mare Suebicum, the Fenni. [[Image:Modlin spichlerz.png|thumb|left|250px|Bugo-Narew estuary into Vistula at Modlin]] However, Tacitus' knowledge of the different peoples was second-hand at best; as such, it should be taken with a grain of salt. He also used the term "Germans" not for describing ethnicity, for example when describing Venedes (Veneds, Venets), Peucyns and Fenns he wrote, that he isn't sure if he should call them Germans, since they have settlements and they fight on foot, or rather Sarmats since they have some similar customs to them. Ptolemy also recorded the Germanic(?) tribes at the Vistula River. The Vistula river is only a short portage from the Dnieper River, and thence to the Black Sea. Boats could be rolled from one river to the next there. What later became the city of Kiev in Ukraine was earlier known by its Gothic name of Danapirstadir "City on the Dnieper". The Baltic Sea-Vistula-Dnieper-Black Sea water route was one of the most ancient trade-routes, the Amber Road, on which amber and other items were traded from Northern Europe to Greece, Asia, Egypt, and elsewhere. ==Towns and tributaries== Torun">Image:Wisla-kolo-Torunia.jpg|thumb|right|300px|Vistula valley south of Torun [[Image:Wisla powodz 2004.jpg|thumb|right|300px|Vistula flooding south of Warsaw, 2004]] {| border="1" cellpadding="1" cellspacing="0" style="font-size: 80%; border: gray solid 1px; border-collapse: collapse; text-align: center;" align="left" width="80%" {| ! colspan="3" style="background:#003399; font-size: 200%" | Vistula |- style="background: #ececec;" ! Town ! Tributaries ! Remarks |- |Wisla, Poland | |Source (river) |- |Ustron | | |- |Skoczów |Brennica | |- |Strumien |Krajka | |- |Goczalkowice-Zdroj | | |- |Czechowice-Dziedzice |Biala | |- |Brzeszcze | | |- |Oswiecim |Sola | |- |Zator |Skawa | |- |Skawina |Skawinka | |- |Kraków |Sanka, Rudawka, Prądnik, Dłubnia, Wilga |most are canalized streams |- |Niepolomice | | |- |Nowe Brzesko | | |- |Nowy Korczyn |Nida (river) | |- |Szczucin | | |- |Polaniec |Czarna | |- |Baranów Sandomierski |Babolówka | |- |Tarnobrzeg | | |- |Sandomierz |Koprzywianka, Trzesniówka | |- |Zawichost | | |- |Annopol |Sanna | |- |Józefów nad Wisla | | |- |Solec nad Wisla | | |- |Kazimierz Dolny |Bystra | |- |Pulawy |Kurówka | |- |Deblin |Wieprz | |- |Magnuszew | | |- |Wilga |Wilga | |- |Góra Kalwaria |Czarna | |- |Karczew | | |- |Otwock, Józefów |Swider | |- |Konstancin-Jeziorna |Jeziorka | |- |Warsaw |Zeran canal |several other minor streams |- |Lomianki | | |- |Legionowo | | |- |Modlin |Bugonarew |Narew and Western Bug rivers combined |- |Zakroczym | | |- |Czerwinsk nad Wisla | | |- |Wyszogród |Bzura | |- |Plock |Słupianka, Brzeźnica | |- |Dobrzyn nad Wisla | | |- |Wloclawek |Zgłowiączka | |- |Nieszawa |Mień | |- |Ciechocinek | | |- |Torun |Drweca, Bacha | |- |Solec Kujawski | | |- |Bydgoszcz |Brda |canalized |- |Chelmno | | |- |Swiecie |Wda | |- |Grudziadz | | |- |Nowe | | |- |Gniew |Wierzyca | |} {| border="1" cellpadding="1" cellspacing="0" style="font-size: 85%; border: gray solid 1px; border-collapse: collapse; text-align: center;" align="left" width="80%" |- valign=top |colspan="6"|Near Kwidzyn Vistula is divided onto two separate branches
that constitute the River delta
|- ! colspan="3" style="background:#ffdead;" width="40%" | Nogat ! colspan="3" style="background:#ffdead;" width="40%" | Leniwka |- style="background: #ececec;" ! Town ! Tributaries ! Remarks ! Town ! Tributaries ! Remarks |- | Sztum | | | Tczew | | |- | Malbork | | | Gdansk | Motlawa, Radunia, Potok Oliwski | in the city the river is divided onto several separate branches that reach the Baltic sea at different points, the main branch reaches the sea at Westerplatte |- | Elblag | Elblag River | shortly before reaching the Vistula Bay | | | |- |} |}
== Right tributaries == List of right tributaries with a nearby city * Brennica - Skoczow * Iłownica * Biała - Czechowice-Dziedzice * Sola * Skawa - Zator * Skawinka - Skawina * Wilga - Krakow * Drwinka * Raba * Gróbka * Uszwica * Kisielina * Dunajec * Breń * Brnik * Wisloka * Babulówka - Baranow Sandomierski * Trzesniówka - Sandomierz * Łęg - Sandomierz * San river * Sanna - Annopol * Wyżnica - Józefów * Chodelka * Bystra - Kazimierz Dolny * Kurówka - Pulawy * Wieprz - Deblin * Okrzejka * Promnik * Wilga - Wilga * Swider - Otwock, Jozefow * Kanał Żerański - Warsaw * Narew with Western Bug and Wkra - Nowy Dwor Mazowiecki * Mołtawa * Słupianka - Plock * Brzeźnica - Plock * Skrwa - Plock * Mień - Nieszawa * Drweca - Torun * Bacha - Torun * Struga * Osa - Grudziadz * Liwa == Left tributaries == List of left tributaries with a nearby city * Krajka - Strumien * Pszczynka * Gostynia * Przemsza - Chelmek * Chech * Rudno * Sanka - Krakow * Rudawa - Krakow * Prądnik - Krakow * Dłubnia - Krakow * Roporek - Nowe Brzesko * Szreniawa * Nidzica * Nida (river) - Nowy Korczyn * Strumień * Czarna - Polaniec * Koprzywianka - Sandomierz * Opatówka * Kamienna * Krępianka - Solec nad Wisla * Ilzanka * Zwoleńka * Plewka - Janowiec * Zagożdzonka - Kozienice * Radomka * Pilica - Warka * Czarna - Gora Kalwaria * Jeziorka - Konstancin-Jeziorna * Bzura - Wyszogrod * Skrwa - Plock * Zgłowiączka - Wloclawek * Tążyna * Zielona * Brda - Bydgoszcz * Wda - Swiecie * Wierzyca - Gniew * Motlawa - Gdansk * Radunia - Gdansk == See also == * Rivers of Poland * Geography of Poland * Vistulan Country Polish rivers lv:Visla


See other meanings of words starting from letter:

V



Words begining with Vistula:

Vistula
Vistula
Vistula,_MI
Vistula,_Michigan
Vistula-Oder_Offensive
Vistula-Oder_offensive
Vistula.jpg
Vistulan_Bay
Vistulan_Country
Vistulan_Country
Vistula_Basin
Vistula_Battle
Vistula_Bay
Vistula_Bay
Vistula_delta
Vistula_Lagoon
Vistula_Lagoon.jpg
Vistula_miracle
Vistula_Peninsula
Vistula_Peninsula
Vistula_peninsula
Vistula_Pomerania
Vistula_River
Vistula_River
Vistula_river
Vistula_Spit


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