
The Qing Dynasty (Manchu language: daicing gurun; Chinese language: 清朝; pinyin: qīng cháo; Wade-Giles: ch'ing ch'ao), sometimes known as the Manchu Dynasty, was founded by the Manchu clan Aisin Gioro, in what is today Manchuria expanded into China proper and the surrounding territories of Inner Asia, establishing the Empire of the Great Qing (Chinese: 大清帝國, pinyin: dàqīng dìguó). The Qing was the last Dynasties in Chinese history. Declared as the Later Jin Dynasty in 1616, it changed its name in 1636 to "Qing", and conquered all of China in 1644, ruling it until 1912. In the aftermath of the Xinhai Revolution, a new Republic of China was established and Pu-yi abdicated. "Later Jin" is sometimes spelled "Later Jinn" to distinguish from another Five Dynasties and Ten Kingdoms Period. The Qing Dynasty was founded not by the Han Chinese people who form the overwhelming majority of the population of China proper, but by the Manchus, a semi-nomadic people not even known by that name when they first rose to prominence in what is now northeastern China. Taking advantage of the political instability and popular rebellions convulsing the Ming dynasty, the highly organized military forces of the Manchus swept into the Ming capital of Beijing in 1644, and there remained until the Qing dynasty was overthrown in a Xinhai Revolution in 1911, with the last emperor abdicating early in 1912. Manchu got into antagonism with Han Chinese only as a result of enforcing the "queue order", which forced the Han Chinese to adopt Manchu hairstyle (the pigtail) and Manchu-style clothing. It was designed to massacre both the Han Chinese bodies and their souls, in the physical as well as spiritual sense. During the 268 years of Manchu rule, numerous Chinese rebellions had ocurred because of the strict rule of haircutting. The Manchus had a special hair style: the infamous "queue". They cut hair off the front skull of their head and made the remaining hair into a long pigtail. The pigtail story might be related to the early Tobas of the 4th-6th century. The Tobas were called ''suo lu'', namely, pigtail styled robbers. (A better English wording for 'lu' would be enemies or savages.) The Chinese had no choice, either hair or head to be cut. The traditional Chinese clothing, or Hanfu was also replaced by Manchu-style clothing. Qipao (or Chinese dress) and Tangzhuang, which are usually regarded as traditional Chinese clothing nowadays, are actually Manchu-style clothing. Manchu edited and forged the history of the former dynasty, ''Ming Shi'' (History of Ming Dynasty). One good example would be the claim that Zhang Xianzhong, who was killed in 1646, had made a stone monument entitled "seven killings". Manchu historians tried to cover up their slaughter of Sichuan Chinese as well as to legalize Manchu's rule over China. To be noted would be the dramatic population drop during the Ming-Qing dynastic transition. To further suppress the Chinese intellectuals, Manchu emperors, like Qianlong Emperor of China, resorted to "literary inquisition" (''Wen Zi Yu'', "imprisonment due to writings") for controlling the minds and thoughts of Chinese. ''Wen Zi Yu'' was the law forbidding people writing any words politically. Many people died from Wen Zi Yu by writing some word which is not even political at all. Manchu forbade the assembly of scholars or intellectuals into societies and moreover advocated "eight-part essay" ("stereotyped essay") as the format for imperial civil service exams. Emperor Kangxi commanded the most complete dictionary of Chinese characters ever put together at the time, and under Emperor Qianlong, the compilation of a catalogue of the important works on Chinese culture was made. Thousands of books viewed by Manchu rulers as politically unacceptable were destroyed when compiling the catalogue. The Manchu also adopted predatory methods of land deprivation. They set up Eight Banners system in the attempt of avoiding the possibility of being assimilated into the Chinese. Eight Banners were military institutions set up to provide a structure with which the Manchu `bannermen' were meant to identify. Banner membership was to be based on traditional Manchu skills such as archery, horsemanship, and frugality. In addition, they were encouraged to use the Manchu language, rather than Chinese. Bannermen were given economic and legal privileges in Chinese cities, meaning that they could often avoid working because they had an "iron rice bowl of privilege" under a form of "apartheid". The novel form became widely read and perhaps China's most famous novel, The Chronicles of the Stone, was written in the mid-eighteenth century. The Taiping Rebellion in the mid-nineteenth century was the first major instance of anti-Manchu sentiment threatening the stability of the Qing dynasty, a phenomenon that would only increase in the following years. However, the horrific number of casualties of this rebellion - as many as 30 million people may have died - and the complete devastation of a huge area in the south of the country have to a large extent been overshadowed by another significant conflict. Although not nearly as bloody, the outside world and its ideas and technologies had a tremendous and ultimately revolutionary impact on an increasingly weak and uncertain Qing state. The 268 years of Qing dynasty China saw glorious successes, humiliating defeats, and profound changes to virtually all aspects of life. Today's China has in many ways been shaped by these experiences. The consolidation of Qing power was accompanied by territorial expansion, and the borders of modern China largely reflect successful Qing military campaigns. == Formation of the Manchu state == The Manchu state was formed by Nurhaci in the early 17th century. Originally a vassal of the Ming, he declared himself Emperor of the Later Jin in 1609. In the same year, he expanded the state's economic and human resources as well as technology by enslaving the Chinese inhabitants of Manchuria. In 1625, Nurhaci established his capital at Shenyang (also Shenjing; Manchu Language: Mukden), but the following year he suffered his first major military defeat to the Ming general Yuan Chonghuan. Nurhaci died the same year. One of his most important achievements was the creation of eight banner units responsible for the civil and military administration of all its troops and their families. Nurhaci's successor Huang Taiji (Abahai) continued to build on his father's foundations, incorporating the first Chinese banners into his army. Huang Taiji also adopted many Ming political institutions into his Manchu state, but also provided for Manchu domination of those institutions through a quota system. When Lingdan Khan, the last grand-Khan of the Mongols, died on his way to Tibet in 1634, his son Ejei surrendered to the Manchus and gave the great seal of the Yuan Dynasty to Huang Taiji. In 1636 Huang Taiji renamed the state Qing (pure) suggesting ambitions beyond Manchuria. In a series of military campaigns, he won the submission of Inner Mongolia, Korea and took control of the Amur River (Heilongjiang) region. == The conquest of China == After years of civil unrest, the Ming capital Beijing was sacked by a coalition of rebel forces led by Li Zicheng. The Ming dynasty officially came to an end when the Chongzhen Emperor of China committed suicide by hanging himself on a tree on the hill overlooking the Forbidden City. After taking Beijing in April 1644, Li Zicheng led an army of 60,000 strong to confront Wu Sangui, the general commanding Ming's 100,000 strong garrison guarding Shanhaiguan (山海關). Shanhaiguan is the pivotal northeastern pass of the Great Wall of China located fifty miles northeast of Beijing and for years its defenses were what kept the Manchus at bay and out of China. Wu, caught between two enemies, decided to cast his lots with the Manchus and made an alliance with Prince Dorgon, regent to the then six-year old Emperor Shunzhi, son of Emperor Huang Taiji who had passed away the year before. Together the two armies met Li Zicheng's rebel forces in battle on May 27, 1644. Even though the rebel forces were routed, Wu's army was so weakened by the day's fighting that he had no choice but to join the Manchus forces as they captured Beijing on June 6 and began their conquest of the whole of China. The process took another seventeen years of battling Ming loyalists, pretenders and rebels. The last Ming pretender, Prince of Gui, sought refuge in Burma but was turned over to a Qing expeditionary force headed by Wu Sangui who had him brought back to Yunnan province and executed in early 1662. ==Kangxi and Consolidation== [[Image:Kangxi.jpg|thumb|200px|The Kangxi Emperor (r. 1662 - 1722)]] The Kangxi Emperor (r. 1662 - 1722) assumed the throne at age seven. During the early years of his reign, he was largely aided by his grandmother, the Grand Empress Dowager, Empress Xiaozhuang. The Manchus found controlling their newly won empire a daunting task. The vastness of China's territory meant that there were only enough banner troops to garrison key cities forming the backbone of a defence network that relied heavily on surrendered Ming soldiers. In addition, three surrendered Ming generals were singled out for their contributions to the Qing imperial cause, ennobled as feudal princes (藩王), and given governorships over vast territories in Southern China. The chief of these was Wu Sangui, who was given the provinces of Yunnan, and Guizhou, while generals Shang Kexi (尚可喜) and Geng Zhongming (耿仲明) were given Guangdong and Fujian provinces, respectively. As the years went by, the three feudal lords and their territories inevitably became increasingly autonomous. Finally, in 1673, Shang Kexi petitioned Kangxi Emperor, stating his desire to retire to his home town in Liaodong (遼東) province and nominating his son as his successor. The young emperor granted his retirement but denied the heredity of his fief. In reaction, the two other generals decided to petition for their own retirements to test Kangxi's resolve, thinking that he wouldn't risk offending them. The move backfired as the young emperor called their bluff by accepting their requests and ordering all three fiefdoms to be reverted back to the crown. Faced with the stripping of their powers, Wu Sangui felt he had no choice but to rise up in revolt. He was joined by Geng Zhongming and Shang Kexi's son Shang Zhixin (尚之信). The ensuing rebellion lasted for eight years. At the peak of the rebels' fortunes, they managed to extend their control as far north as the river Changjiang (長江). Ultimately, though, the Qing government was able to put down the rebellion and exert control over all of southern China. The threats, however, weren't all internal. Kangxi Emperor of China personally led China on a series of military campaigns against Tibet, the Jüün Ghar, and later Russia. He arranged the marriage of his daughter to the Khan Gordhun to avoid an invasion. Gordhun's military campaign against the Qing failed, further strengthening the Empire. By the end of the 17th century, China was at its most powerful since the early Yuan Dynasty. Taiwan was also taken by Qing forces in 1683 from Zheng Chenggong's son, Zheng Jing; the former had conquered it from the Netherlands. Kangxi also handled many Jesuit Missionaries that came to China hoping for mass conversions. Although they failed in their attempt, Kangxi still peacefully kept the missionaries in Beijing. Civil order and recognition by the people of Qing was Kangxi's foremost agenda. ==The Yongzheng & Qianlong emperors== Yongzheng Emperor of China (r. 1723 - 1735) and his son Qianlong Emperor of China (r. 1735 - 1796) and their reigns were at the height of Qing power. After Kangxi's death in the winter of 1722, his fourth son, Yinzhen (later to be known as Emperor Yongzheng) succeeded. Yongzheng remained a controversial character because of rumours about him usurping the throne. Nonetheless Yongzheng was a very hardworking ruler. His first big step towards a stronger regime came when he brought the Imperial examination back to its original standards. In 1724 he cracked down on illegal exchange rates of coins, which was being manipulated by officials to fit their financial needs. Yongzheng was known as harsh, and in many ways, ruthless. Yongzheng did show trust in Han officials, and appointed many of his proteges to prestigious positions. Nian Gengyao was appointed to lead a military campaign. Yonzheng's reign saw more consolidation of territory, a toughened stance towards corrupt officials, and the creation of a Military Affairs Department (軍機處). Yongzheng died in 1735, shortly after he ordered his third son, Hongshi, to commit suicide. This was followed by the succession of his son Hongli as the Qianlong Emperor of China. Qianlong was known as an able general. Succeeding the throne at the age of 24, Qianlong personally led the military in campaigns near Xinjiang and Mongolia. Revolts and uprisings in Sichuan and parts of southern China were successfully calmed. Around forty years into Qianlong's reign, the Qing government saw a return of rampant corruption. Officials such as Ho Shen was arguably one of the most corrupt in the entire Qing Dynasty. He was eventually executed by Qianlong's son Jiaqing Emperor of China (r. 1796 - 1820). ==Rebellion, unrest and external pressure== One common view of the 19th century was that it was an era in which Qing control weakened, and prosperity diminished. China suffered massive social strife, economic stagnation, and explosive population growth. Moreover, starting with the reign of the Daoguang Emperor of China (r. 1820–1850), China was increasingly connected to Russia, the West, and later Japan. International and global influence was more freely allowed into the country. Britain's desire to continue its opium trade with China collided with imperial edicts prohibiting the addictive drug, and the First Opium War erupted in 1840. China lost the war; subsequently, Britain and other Western powers, including the United States, occupied "concessions" and gained special commercial privileges. Hong Kong was ceded to Britain in 1842 under the Treaty of Nanking. Sovereign areas already hospitable to informal empire largely avoided formal rule during the shift to New Imperialism. China, for instance, was not a backward country unable to secure the prerequisite stability and security for western-style commerce, but a relatively stable empire unwilling to admit global commerce. The strong nature of China's market helps explain international contentment with informal 'Spheres of Influences'. China notably possessed a securable market without formal control. While China had an inferior negotiation position relative to other large powers, it was a major destination for investment capital. International powers did intervene military there to quell domestic chaos, such as the Taiping Rebellion and the anti-global Boxer Rebellion. For example, General "Chinese" Gordon, later killed by the isolationist Mahdi Army in the Sudan, is often credited as having saved the Manchu dynasty from the Taiping insurrection. Others maintain China was able to save itself, at the cost of millions of civilian casualties. In addition, the Taiping Rebellion (太平起義) (1851-1864), the Nian Rebellion (捻軍起義) (1853-1868) and the Muslim Panthay Rebellion, along with Russian-supported Muslim separatist movements in Gansu province and Xinjiang (also called Chinese Turkestan or East Turkestan), drained Chinese resources and almost toppled the dynasty. Han officials such as Zeng Guofan was sent out to crush the Taiping rebellion, which had gathered a lot of strength over the years. After several failed military campaigns, Zeng Guofan's brother Zeng Guoquan was aband was credited partly to Li Hongzhang's Huai Army. The end to two large revolts, however, did little to ensure stability within the Empire. There was increasing pressure from external powers. [[Image:China_imperialism_cartoon.jpg|thumbnail|250px|In this political cartoon, China is being divided up by the United Kingdom, Germany, Russia, France, and Japan]] ==The Rule of Empress Dowager Cixi== In the late 19th century, a new leader emerged. The Empress Dowager Cixi, concubine to the Xianfeng Emperor (r. 1850-1861), the mother of child emperor Tongzhi Emperor of China, and Aunt of Guangxu Emperor of China successfully controlled the Qing government and was the de facto leader of China for close to 40 years. She staged a coup d'état to oust the regency led by Sushun (Chinese) appointed by the late Emperor. She was known for her "behind the curtain" (垂帘聼政) participation in politics. By the 1860s, the Qing dynasty had put down the rebellions with the help of militia organized by the Chinese gentry. The Qing government then proceeded to deal with problem of modernization, which it attempted with the Self-Strengthening Movement. Several modernized armies were formed including the much renowned Beiyang Army; however the fleets of "Beiyang" were annihilated in the Sino-Japanese War (1894-1895), which produced calls for greater and more extensive reform. After the start of the 20th century, the Qing Dynasty was in a dilemma. It could proceed with reform and thereby alienate the conservative gentry or it could stall reform and thereby alienate the revolutionaries. The Qing Dynasty tried to follow a middle path, but proceeded to alienate everyone. 10 years into the reign of Guangxu Emperor of China (r. 1875 - 1908), western pressure was so big on China that she forcefully gave up all sorts of power. In 1898 Guangxu attempted the Hundred Days' Reform (百日维新/戊戌变法), in which new laws were put in place and some old rules were abolished. Newer, more progressive-minded thinkers like Kang Youwei was trusted and recognized conservative-minded people like Li Hongzhang were removed from high positions. but the ideals were stifled by Cixi and Guangxu was jailed in his own palace. Cixi, on the other hand, only concentrated on her own power and well being. At the occasion of her 60th Birthday she spend over 30 million taels of silver for the decorations & events, an unthinkable amount even by today's terms. In 1901, following the murder of the German Ambassador, the Alliance of Eight Nations (八國聯軍) entered China as a united military force for the second time. Cixi reacted by declaring war on all eight nations, only to see Beijing under their control within a short period of time. Along with the Guangxu Emperor, she fled to Xi'an. As a military compensation, the Alliance listed scores of demands on the Qing Government, including an initial hitlist which had Cixi as No. 1. Li Hongzhang was sent to negotiate and the Alliance backed down from several of the demands. ==Fall of the Dynasty== Mass civil disorder had also begun and continuously grown. Cixi and the Guangxu emperor both died in 1908, leaving a relatively powerless and unstable central authority. The Puyi of Zaifeng, Prince Chun, was appointed successor at age two, leaving Zaifeng with the regency. This was followed by the dismissal of General Yuan Shikai from his former positions of power. In mid 1911 Zaifeng created the "Imperial Family Cabinet", a ruling council of the Imperial Government almost entirely consisting of Aisin Gioro relatives. This brought a wide range of negative opinion from senior officials like Zhang Zhidong. The Wuchang Uprising succeeded on October 10th, 1911, and was followed by a proclamation of a separate central government, the Republic of China, in Nanjing with Sun Yat-sen as its provisional head. Numerous provinces began "separating" from Qing control. Seeing a desperate situation unfold, the Qing government brought an unwilling Yuan Shikai back to military power, taking control of his Beiyang Army, with the initial goal of crushing the revolutionaries. After taking the position of Prime Minister (内阁总理大臣) and creating his own cabinet, Yuan went as far as to ask for the removal of Zaifeng from the regency. This removal later proceeded with directions from Empress Dowager Longyu. With Zaifeng gone, Yuan Shi-kai and his Beiyang commanders effectively dominated Qing politics. He reasoned that going to war would be unreasonable and costly, especially when noting that the Qing Government had a goal for constitutional monarchy. Similarly, Sun Yat-sen's government wanted a Republican constitutional reform, both aiming for the benefit of China's economy and populace. With permission from Empress Dowager Longyu, Yuan began negotiating with Sun Yat-sen, who decided that his goal had been achieved in forming a republic, and that therefore he could allow Yuan to step into the position of President of the Republic. In 1912, after rounds of negotiations, Longyu issued the Imperial Edict bringing about the abdication of the child emperor Puyi. The collapse of the Qing dynasty in 1912 brought an end to over 2000 years of imperial history in China and began an extended period of instability, not just at the national level but in many areas of peoples' lives. Obvious political and economic backwardness combined with widespread criticism of Chinese culture led to questioning and doubt about the future. China's turbulent history since the overthrow of the Qing may be understood at least in part as an attempt to understand and recover significant aspects of historic Chinese culture and integrate them with influential new ideas that have emerged within the last century. The Qing dynasty is the source of much of this magnificent culture, but its perceived humiliations also provide much from which to learn. ==Qing society== Manchu males had the custom of braiding hair into a pigtail known as a queue. During the Qing Dynasty, the Manchus enforced this custom onto the Han Chinese population, and any male who was seen without pigtail outdoors was to be beheaded. ==Qing politics== The most important administrative body of the Qing dynasty was the Grand Council which was a body composed of the emperor and high officials. The Qing dynasty was characterized by a system of dual appointments by which each position in the central government had a Manchu and a Han Chinese assigned to it. During the Qianlong Emperor's reign, for example, members of his family were distinguished by garments with a large circular emblem on the back, whereas a Han could only hope to wear clothing with a square emblem; this meant effectively that any guard in the court could immediately distinguish family members from the back view alone. With respect to Mongolia, Tibet and Eastern Turkestan, the Qing Dynasty maintained a loose system of control, with the Qing emperor acting as Mongol Khan, patron of Tibetan Buddhism and supporter of Muslims and keeping a loose system of control. How this system is best described remains a strong point of controversy because of its current political implications. Supporters of Chinese nationalism argue that Qing rule over these areas is best described as an extremely high degree of autonomy within a single nation-state, while supporters of Tibetan independence argue that the Qing dynasty was a personal union between many nation-states. However, Qing policy changed with the establishment of Xinjiang province in 1884. In response to British and Russian military action in Xinjiang and Tibet, the Qing sent New Army units which performed remarkably well against British units. The abdication of the Manchu Emperor, who had integrated the Empire, inevitably led to the controversy about the status of the Qing outer territories. It was and remains the position of Mongols and Tibetan nationalists, that because they owed allegiance to the Qing monarch in a personal capacity, that with the abdication of the Qing, they owed no allegiance to the Chinese state. This position was rejected by the new Republic of China and subsequent People's Republic of China which have claimed that these areas remained integral parts of China. The Western powers accepted the latter theory, largely in order to prevent a scramble for China. ==Qing military== The development of the Chinese military system during the Qing Dynasty can be divided into two broad periods separated by the Taiping rebellion (1850 - 64). Early Qing military was organized around the Manchu banner system first developed by Nurhachi as a way to organize Manchurian society beyond petty clan affiliations. There were eight banners in all, differentiated by colours. The banners in their order of precedence were as follows: Yellow, Border Yellow, White, Red, Blue, Border White, Border Red, Border Blue. The Yellow, Border Yellow, and White banners were collectively known as the ‘Upper Three Banners’(上三旗) and were under the direct command of the Emperor. Only members of the Upper Three Banners could become the Emperor's personal bodyguards. The remaining banners were known as ‘The Lower Five Banners’ (下五旗) and were each commanded by hereditary princes within the Banner known by the informal title of ‘Iron Cap Princes’ (铁帽子王). Together they formed the ruling council of the entire Manchu nation as well as high command of the Manchurian army. The Iron Cap Princes continued to exercise considerable infleunce over the political and military policies of Qing government until the reign of Emperor Qianglong. As Qing power expanded north of the great wall during the last years of the Ming dynasty, this social military system was expanded by Nurhachi's son and successor Hong Taiji to include parallel Mongolian and Chinese banners. After their conquest of China, the relatively small banner armies were augmented by the Green Standard Army (綠營兵) which outnumbered banner troops by three to one. The Green Standard Army so-named after the colour of their battle standards was made up of ethnic Han Chinese troops who had surrendered to the Manchus during the conquest. They are led by a mixture of Banner and Green Standard officers. The Banners and Green Standard troops were standing armies, paid for by central government. In addition, regional governors from provincial down to village level maintained their own irregular local militias for police duties and disaster relief. These militias were usually granted small annual stipends from regional coffers for part-time service obligations. They received very limited military drill if at all and were not considered combat troops. Banner Armies were divided along ethnic lines, namely Manchurian and Mongolian and subdivided into eight different colour banners each. There existed a third branch of Chinese bannermen which consisted of those who had joined the Manchus before their conquest of China. However these Chinese bannermen were not regarded by the Manchurian Qing government as equal to the other two branches due to their late addition to the Manchu cause as well as their Han Chinese ancestry. The nature of their service - mainly as infantry, artillery and sappers, was also seen as alien to the Manchurian nomadic traditions of fighting as cavalry. After the conquest of China proper the military roles played by Chinese Bannermen were quickly subsumed by the Green Standard Army. The socio-military origins of the Banner system meant that population within each branch and their sub-divisions were hereditary and rigid. Only under special circumstances sanctioned by imperial edict were social movements between banners permitted. In contrast, the Green Standard Army was originally intended to be a professional volunteer force. However during protracted period of peace in China from the 18th to mid 19th centuries, recruits from farming communities dwindled, due partly to Neo-Confucianism's negative stance on military careers. In order to maintain strengths, the Green Standard Army began to internalize, and gradually became hereditary in practice. After the conquest, the approximately 200,000 strong Manchu Banner Army was evenly divided; half was designated the Forbidden Eight Banner Army (jinlubaqi|禁旅八旗)and was stationed in Beijing. It served both as the capital's garrison and Qing government's main strike force. The remainder of the Banner troops was distributed to guard key cities in China. These were known as the Territorial Eight Banner Army (zhufanbaqi|駐防八旗). The Manchu rulers, keenly aware of their own minority status, reinforced a strict policy of racial segregation between the Manchus and Mongols from Han Chinese for fear of their being assimilated by Han culture while living in close proximity with the newly subjugated Han people. This policy applied directly to the Banner garrisons, most of which occupied a separate walled zone within the cities they were stationed at. In cities where there were limitation of space such as in Qingzhou (青州), a new fortified town was purposely erected to house the Banner garrison and their families. Beijing, being the imperial seat, was a special case: the Regent Dorgon ordered the entire Chinese population forcibly relocated to the southern suburbs. The walled city was portioned out to the remaining Manchu eight Banners, each responsibled for guarding a section of the city that surrounded the Forbidden City palace complex(紫禁城). The policy of posting Banner troops as territorial garrison was not to protect but to inspire awe in the subjugated Chinese populace at the expense of their expertise as cavalry. As a result, after a century of peace and lack of training the Territorial Banner troops had deteriorated greatly in their combat worthiness. This is mirrored by a similar if slower decline in the Green Standard Army. In peace time, soldiering became merely a source of supplementary income. Soldiers and commanders alike neglected training in pursuit of their own economic gains. Corruption was rampant as regional commanders submitted pay and supply requisitions based on exaggerated head counts to the quartermaster department and pocketed the difference. When the Taiping Rebellion broke out in 1850s the Qing Court found out belatedly that both the Territorial Banner troops and Green Standards could not on their own put down even local rebellions let alone keep foreign invaders at bay - losing both the first (1839 -1842) and second (1856 -1860) Opium Wars. However to the Qing government the more serious problem was internal. The Qing military forces suffered a series of disastrous defeats at the hands of the Taiping rebels culminating in the loss of the city of Jinling (金陵) - present day Nanjing (南京). The fall of Jinling in 1853 saw the massacre of its entire Manchu garrison and their attached families in the city. Shortly thereafter rebel expeditionary forces penetrated as far north as the suburbs of Tianjin (天津). In desperation the Qing court ordered a Chinese mandarin Zhen Goufan (曾國藩)to reorganize the regional and village militias (Tuanyong|團勇,Xianyong|鄉勇) to contain the Taiping rebels. The force Zhen created became known as "Xiang" Army (湘軍), named after the region it was raised. Xiang Army was a hybrid between local militia force and a standing army. It was better trained and led than local militias, but was paid for in most parts by regional coffers and funds its commanders - mostly Chinese gentries - could muster. Xiang Army and the Huai Army (淮军) that came after it collectively were called Yongying (勇營), a system built on the Neo-Confucian idea of binding the troops' loyalty to their immediate superiors and to the regions which they were raised. This gave the troops, at least in the short term, a higher level of esprit de corp. However in the long run it created more problems for the Qing government. Firstly, the raise of Youngying military system signalled the beginning of the end of Manchu dominance in military matters. Secondly, its command structure fostered cronyism amongst regional (ethnic Han) army commanders and laid the seeds to warlordism. By late 1800s, with China fast descending into a semi colonial state, even the most conservative elements in the Qing court could no longer ignore China's military weakness in contrast to the foreign "barbarians" literally beating down its gates. The advent of western weaponry such as repeating rifles and steam driven dreadnought battleships rendered China's traditionally trained and equipped army and navy useless in face of the invading foreign powers. Attempts were made to reform military institutions and to train certain units in westernized drills, tactics and weaponry. These units were collectively called the New Model Army (新式陸軍). The most successful was the Beiyang Army (北洋軍) under the overall supervision and control of the Chinese general Yuan Shikai (袁世凱), who exploited his position to eventually become the Republic president, dictator and finallly abortive emperor of China. ==Related topics== *List of Emperors of the Qing Dynasty *List of Manchu clans *Manchu official headwear *Mandarin square History of China History of Mongolia History of Manchuria Qing Dynasty nds:Qing-Dynastie
Nanshu: the Qing Emperor was a "supporter of Muslims"? In what way was he a supporter of Uygur and Hui muslims? What were the official Islamic titles confered to him by Uygur and Hui communities? Or did he on his own behalf have a contract of some sort with Uygur and Hui princes and "ahunds"? To what extend did Uygur princes forgo their political connections with the Uzbek, Timurid princes outside of Qing jurisdiction in order to become vassals of the Aisin Gioros? What ethnic-national princely or honorary titles did the Aisin Gioro emperors formally take on? I guess "the governor of the Nakhis" or "the chief of the Nungs" wouldn't be part of them. :I do not know the accurate term, but Turkic Muslims in Eastern Turkestan justified the non-Islamic rule by "duty of salt": man should not betray who granted a faver. User:Nanshu 02:18 Feb 10, 2003 (UTC) --- I changed the first sentence to a form which I think will avoid a political flame and besides is more accurate. The Qing dynasty didn't rule Tibet until 1723 and Xinjiang until the mid 18th century, so stating that they were the ruling dynasty of Tibet and East Turkestan between 1644 and 1912 is inaccurate anyhow. -- User:Roadrunner ----- I changed China to China proper for NPOV reasons. I'm not altogether satisfied with the section on Qing administration of outer areas, because the notion that Qing rule was a personal union is not universally accepted (for obvious political reasons) -- User:Roadrunner --- Reworded statement on Qing rule in outer areas. Also I took out the statement about 1884 marking intervening of Han Chinese into the outer Qing Dynasty. First of all, before 1884, Han Chinese were not simply another subject people, and second the Qing dynasty did intervene in outer regions at various points. Also I have problems with the last sentence but will have to think about how to reword it. -- User:Roadrunner Changed the date from 1636 to 1644. The Manchus did declare a new dynasty in 1636 but they called it the Jin. The Qing dynasty wasn't declared until 1644 after the capture of Beijing. : No. It was in 1616 that the State of Jin was established by Nurhaci. In 1636 his son Hong Taiji declared the new dynasty of Qing in Mukden recommended by the Manchus, Mongols and Chinese. That's why the era name was changed from ''sure han'' to ''wesihun erdemunnge''. So 1636 is correct. -- User:Nanshu :: Thanks!!!! I stand corrected them -- User:Roadrunner ---- Aisin Gioro is the original Manchu spelling, not anglicized name. -- User:Nanshu ---- Are the "Manchu Flagged Factions" mentioned the Banner systems? --~~ ---- Some dates of reign in the table do not match the dates given in the individual articles: * Qianlong Emperor of China * Kangxi Emperor of China ---- == The List == Is that table necessary? I believe there is already an article containing such table. :o --User:Gboy 04:30, 1 Nov 2003 (UTC) :Where? The one with ''all'' the Chinese soveriegns? Some people may have trouble loading that page because it is so long. --User:Jiang 05:29, 1 Nov 2003 (UTC) ::I can't remember. Maybe I am wrong, maybe I confuse that with XXX Emperor of China? But i totally agree with you that that table is really long! Why not split them into several pages? --User:Gboy 05:41, 1 Nov 2003 (UTC) : Perhaps List of rulers of the Qing Dynasty. --User:Menchi 05:46, 1 Nov 2003 (UTC) ::I don;t think that's necessary. The page hasnt reached 32kb yet. --User:Jiang ---- ""If political conditions in a particular overseas markets were stable enough, Britain could ____ its economy through free trade alone without having to resort to formal rule or mercantilism. "" --User:Cylauj 15:03, 29 Apr 2004 (UTC) == Listing of names == It is non-standard to list the different names and romanizations in bullet point format. If you seek to make this standard, then please go propose it at Wikipedia talk:Manual of Style for China-related articles. Otherwise, the standard is to put everything in parenthesis and start the article with a complete introductory sentence. Also, "Empire of the Great Qing" was the official name of the country ruled by the Qing Dynasty. The two are not entirely synonymous. --User:JiangUser talk:Jiang 03:39, 27 Jun 2004 (UTC) :I'm not seeking to change the standard, just address a unique (I think) situation where there are ''five'' alternative names, a situation which demands clarity so as not to confuse the reader. If, however, you think that it is also worth considering adopting bullet points as a standard for all China-related articles to cover Chinese, pinyin, W-G, etc, then I will be happy to make such a suggestion, although it will obviously involve editing an awful lot of articles. As to "Empire of the Great Qing", you are right that it is not synonynous with "Qing dynasty", but it is also not synonymous with "China", as you write. - User:Madw 06:43, Jun 27, 2004 (UTC) I don't think this article deserves an exception to the rule. I don't see how the reader will be confused as along as we use parenthesis and italics. How is this different from four? or three? I don't agree with this format, as it is standard everywhere to begin with a full and complete sentence. During Qing rule, China was referred to diplomatically as the "Empire of the Great Qing" and commonly as the "Chinese Empire" or "Ch'ing Empire". Of course, this referred to the Manchu domains. The term "China" did include all of what the Qing ruled over. China does not and has not always been synonymous with China proper.--User:JiangUser talk:Jiang 07:00, 27 Jun 2004 (UTC) :Surely the priority for all articles must be to make things as clear as possible for the readers, rather than sticking religiously to a particular standard. Maybe your original suggestion of considering adopting such a new, clearer standard for all China-related articles, where multiple alternatives almost always exist, is the way forward. But there are always likely to be exceptions, and in such cases making articles easily understood must always come first IMO. I'd be interested in hearing what others have to say on this matter... :As to "Qing dynasty" being synonymous with "China" - this is just plain wrong. The Qing administration did not take this view, hence the 理藩院 ''Lifanyuan'' and a different system of governance; foreigners did not take this view, hence Manchuria, Mongolia, East Turkestan, Tibet, etc; and the Chinese word 中国 did not include all these territories in its meaning until the arrival of the revolutionary groups at the end of the Qing, as seen in the works of 19th century scholars such as 魏源 Wei Yuan, etc. Making "Qing dynasty" synonymous with "China" is always anachronistic - the ruling house wasn't even Chinese! This is a mistake that we should not be making. - User:Madw 07:50, Jun 27, 2004 (UTC) ::I agree that Making "Qing dynasty" synonymous with "China" is always anachronistic. it is the same case with yuan dynasty.It is ridiculous to say "yuan dynasty" synonymous with "China" because everyone knows that in fact "yuan dynasty" is part of the Mongol Empire. what jiang said is out of political motivation. I've surely seen 19th century maps outlining the Qing Empire but labelled "Chinese Empire". The [http://50.1911encyclopedia.org/C/CH/CHINA.htm 1911 EB] article discusses all of the Qing Empire, and phrases it "''CHINA, a country of eastern Asia, the principal division of the Chinese empire. In addition to China proper the Chinese Empire includes Manchuria, Mongolia, Tibet and Sin-kiang (East Turkestan, Kulja, Dzungaria, &c., i.e. all the Chinese dependencies lying between. Mongolia on the north and Tibet on the south).''" Ditto for the [http://www.newadvent.org/cathen/03663b.htm Catholic Encyclopedia]: "''The Chinese Empire, the largest political division of Eastern Asia, extends from 18°10' to 53°45' N. lat., and from 73°47' to 134°25' E. long. It includes China proper or the Eighteen Provinces (Shi-pa-sheng), theoretically a subject territory of Manchuria, the cradle of the present dynasty, and the dependencies: Mongolia, Ili (or Sin-kiang), and Tibet.''" The ruling house wasn't ''Han'' Chinese. But anyhow, we don't need to assert or imply any of this and I think the current wording is fine. I do not believe obscuring the opening sentence of this articles with transliterations and translations the average Chinese/Manchu-illiterate reader could care less about makes the article clearer. I do not see how putting these in parenthesis makes the text incomprehensible. If there's not much difference, it is my opinion to go by the standard. What do you think should be the convention for breaking names into bullets? How many entries? Maybe we can have a full section of names like at Sun Yat-sen, but that requires more than mere translations/transliterations.--User:JiangUser talk:Jiang 10:50, 27 Jun 2004 (UTC) :We are going to be in serious trouble if we start writing our Asian history articles according to what century-old Western texts say! I would be happy to point you to more recent and relevant source material if that would be of help. :As for the organization of the opening, it is the ''current'' standard that "obscur[es] the opening sentence" and that is the reason for considering something different. We need to make it easier for the Chinese/Manchu-illiterate reader to read the first sentence. You mention the Sun Yat-sen article - well it's beginning is a mess. It doesn't know whether the names should be in the intro or the names section. :You asked my opinion, well look at the Sun article and you will see the changes I would make. As I think about it, there are 2 issues - Chinese/romanization and alternative names. Every article will have Chinese/romanization but alternative names will usually be restricted to people. For me it is very important to make the article highly readable, especially the introduction. I would therefore include romanization in parentheses directly under the title of the article and separated from the intro text. After the introductory text, a list of recognized (not obscure) alternative names could be introduced so that if the reader has come to the page looking for one of these names, perhaps via a redirect, it will be clear that they are in the right place. After all, we have to help the reader find the information they came looking for. For most people, the info would include xing, ming, zi, and hao, with rulers being a little different. If there were only one alternative name, it may be more appropriate to include this in the introductory text - common sense will dictate. It seems to me that this satisfies all important criteria - provides the relevant info but still in a highly readable format. So I guess, the more I think about it, yes, I do think a new standard would be better for China-related articles, and I will probably suggest such on the relevant page when I can get around to it. In the meantime, I have changed this page again to reflect latest thinking. That's my opinion anyway... - User:Madw 16:53, Jun 27, 2004 (UTC) If the stuff in the parenthesis is too long, then I suggest abbreviating (as you have done here) or compacting (as has been done at Deng Xiaoping). Once you copy the second part of your post over to the MoS page, I will respond to your points there. I disagree with some of your points but agree with others. In the meantime, we will go by the current standards as there is no consensus to change it. As for the emperors having a whole bunch of names, I think we should give them each biographical taxoboxes, like every Prime Minister of the United Kingdom (as opposed to having a wide box at the bottom). We can make each of their names a line in the box. Or maybe we can extend this to every Chinese person with a whole bunch of names...but this can be discussed at the Chinese MoS too. Let me know here what you think about adding it to the emperors though. --User:JiangUser talk:Jiang 21:48, 27 Jun 2004 (UTC) :I will address emperors later - it is a problem that I have already given some thought to. I have added my comments to the MoS page, and the discussion can continue there. - User:Madw 01:45, Jun 28, 2004 (UTC) General request: For the time being, please do not change the style of the introduction for this article as it is currently the subject of discussion at Wikipedia talk:Manual of Style for China-related articles. Thank-you - User:Madw 01:45, Jun 28, 2004 (UTC) :Aside from noting that the format should not be changed short of consensus, there are other reasons I made the changes I did. The sentence "The Qing dynasty was the last Dynasties in Chinese history. " was already stated in the intro and doesn't need to be repeated in the first section. In fact, the entire "overview" section violates the MoS - we should have a lead section and just that. Split part of it into the lead section and the others into the article sections.
:The Republic was founded before Puyi abdicated and such events should be listed in chronological order. the 'd' in "dynasty" is capitalized for the article and should therefore also be capitalized in the bolded text. --User:JiangUser talk:Jiang 02:31, 17 Jul 2004 (UTC)
Point taken on the overview section - I'll work on incorporating that into the intro, along with anyone else wanting to have a go, but that will probably take a day or two. However, the 'd' in 'dynasty' should ''not'' be capitalized as it is not a proper name - check any other encyclopedia or history book relating to China and that will become clear. This page needs to be moved to 'Qing dynasty', but given all the other discussions of recent times on other subjects I have chosen not to add to the confusion by moving it at this time. As it will happen before long though, and as it is the correct form, it should be left as 'd' for now pending the page move. - User:Madw 10:51, Jul 17, 2004 (UTC)
:Please do not blanket revert my changes without exlaining why each of them are not appropriate. I don't see why it's wrong to include the pinyin of da qing di guo. The sentence "The Qing dynasty was the last Dynasties in Chinese history. " is still redundant. What's wrong with saying "expanded into China proper"? It's more specific in my opinon than "provinces of the Ming dynasty". there's also no need to wikify "Chinese language" twice.
:As for the box (in light of what you added to the MoS), i don't think the situation calls for one yet. There are only four names to deal with, and that's not too much like with Sun Yat-sen. If we add it, let's make it look good. It should be merged with the series table or have both replaced with a taxobox and a footer used instead. As it is, the name box is hideous. --User:JiangUser talk:Jiang 20:19, 17 Jul 2004 (UTC)
I have already acknowledged that the intro/overview section should be reviewed, when all the edits you just mentioned can be addressed. The whole section is likely to change, so I wasn't getting too worked up about the details right now. As for the box, we obviously have different views, but to help me understand yours better, please explain why you think the name box is "hideous" - I just don't get that statement. - User:Madw 01:10, Jul 18, 2004 (UTC)
:We have a series box next to the name box. it's looks crunched, but that's my opinion. We can maybe replace the series with a footer. One the Qing flag is uploaded, it needs to go on top and then the names can be placed right underneath like how Sun Yat-sen's portrait is over all the names he is given. Or we can try maps...or whatever --User:JiangUser talk:Jiang 05:41, 18 Jul 2004 (UTC)
That's clearer, and maybe we can discuss something along the lines you mention, although I myself don't think the page looks crunched. Does anyone else (who would be willing to make this more than a dialogue!) wish to share an opinion? Let me also say that I don't think that the flag should be displayed at the top of the page, although I don't mind it being added lower down. The Qing did not even have a state flag until 1872 and it never had the significance attached to it common in Western cultures. Putting the flag at the top of the page would give the erroneous impression that the flag was a significant state emblem - especially as most readers will have Western preconceptions of the flag's importance. - User:Madw 12:44, Jul 18, 2004 (UTC)
----
==New page title for Qing Emperors==
As I said before [http://en.wikipedia.org/w/wiki.phtml?title=Wikipedia_talk:Naming_conventions_%28Chinese%29&diff=1228258&oldid=1190294], the current page title "{era name} Emperor of China" is inappropriate. I will change it to "{era name} of the Qing".
The Qing Dynasty used to be regarded as a "Chinese empire." It is mainly because researchers only utilized Chinese literature and the Westerners projected that the last days of the dynasty to the whole history. But postwar studies has drastically changed the situation. We can access to Manchu, Mongolian, Chagatai and Tibetan documents and see the "Chinese world order" didn't affect these regions. Various alternate models have been proposed by scholars. Newly-published "清帝国とチベット問題" by 平野聡 assembles them.
Scholars no longar consider the dynasty as a mere Chinese empire. Thus the anachronistirc title "{era name} Emperor of China" should be corrected. I chose "{era name} of the Qing" but "{era name} Emperor" is also fine because Qing era names look unique throughout history. --User:Nanshu 06:12, 5 Aug 2004 (UTC)
:"{era name} Emperor" should be good enough. The title doesn't need to tell all. --User:JiangUser talk:Jiang 06:48, 5 Aug 2004 (UTC)
I will go with "{era name} Emperor". --User:Nanshu 03:50, 11 Aug 2004 (UTC)
I really think the "{era name} Emperor" format is good enough. User:Colipon 00:38, 12 Aug 2004 (UTC)
== Empress Dowager Cixi ==
I know that for Empress Dowager Cixi it says:
Cixi, on the other hand, only concentrated on her own power and well being. At the occasion of her 60th Birthday she spend over 30 million taels of silver for the decorations & events, an unthinkable amount even by today's terms.
But in the Dowager Empress Cixi article itself mentions both the traditional 'evil despot' and the revisionist view of her as an able ruler and painted as a bad ruler due mostly to circumstance. I think that section of the article needs more NPOV.
== Re-organization ==
I was thinking of revising some sections in this article and perhaps separating some parts like "Qing Military" into another article. Help would be appreciated. User:Colipon+(User_talk:Colipon)">User:Colipon|User:Colipon+(User talk:Colipon) 07:03, 18 Dec 2004 (UTC)
:not needed, IMO, or at least not until the page reaches its limites. We should link to and expand on those articles. --User:JiangUser talk:Jiang 08:21, 18 Dec 2004 (UTC)
::You misunderstood, Jiang. I meant creating an article called Qing Military so that the Qing Dynasty article is about pretty much only the history and its influence. User:Colipon+(User_talk:Colipon)">User:Colipon|User:Colipon+(User talk:Colipon) 02:47, 19 Dec 2004 (UTC)
No, I understood. But everything about the Qing is history since it no longer exists. Military and politics is within the scope of this article and should not have been split out, unless we were running out of room and even then we use summary style, not brute excising. We need to cover everything here.--User:JiangUser talk:Jiang 06:17, 19 Dec 2004 (UTC)
== The Qing Dynasty would not have fallen if not for the revolutionaries. Agree? ==
So what do you think? If there weren't no revolutionaries.. would the Qing Dynasty have fallen?
I think its a yes. Quite obviously. They would still fall in the hands of foreign power. Like Britain. And Russia. And France. Besides, the officials etc are so corrupted, taking bribes and everything, it'll be a miracle if China could survive for so long.
What do you think?
Please share your views with me.
I'd really like to learn.
== Population numbers ==
''To be noted would be the dramatic population drop during the Ming-Qing dynastic transition: In AD 1620, i.e., 1st year of Ming Emperor Guangzong's Taichang Era, China boasted of a population of 51.66 million people, but in AD 1651, i.e., 8th year of Qing Emperor Shizu's Shunzhi Era, China only had 10.63 million people. The conclusion is that China's brave men had fallen martyrdom in the resistance to Manchu invasion. ''
Are these claims credible? 10 Million appear to be very, very few to me.
See
http://afe.easia.columbia.edu/china/geog/population.htm#2b or
http://www.iiasa.ac.at/Research/LUC/ChinaFood/data/pop/pop_21_m.htm
The article in general seems to quite biased in disfavor of the Qing.
User:Malbi 13:48, 28 Apr 2005 (UTC)
== Fragment needs cleanup ==
I came to this article through the Wikipedia:WikiProject_Punctuation. This article had been flagged by scripts looking for sentences missing punctuation. The problematic "sentence" (actually a fragment) is at the end of the introduction, right above the TOC:
:The incorporation of new lands and peoples required careful handling, and Manchu experience
Looking back at the history I found that the second half of this sentence got broken off, made into a complete sentence, and moved farther up the article. However, that change left this part orphaned as a fragment. I couldn't come up with any satisfactory fix off the top of my head, as I would need to read more of the article to understand the context. Therefore I'm marking it in case someone knowledgeable about the Qing Dynasty wants to make a fix.
I'll also put a
Qing Dynasty and all its related articles. History of China History of Mongolia History of Manchuria Royal families
#redirect Qing Dynasty
See other meanings of words starting from letter:A | B | C | C | D | E | F | G | H | I | J | K | L | M | N | O | P | R | S | T | U | V | X | Y | Z |
Qing Dynasty
The Qing Dynasty (Manchu language: daicing gurun; Chinese language: 清朝; pinyin: qīng cháo; Wade-Giles: ch'ing ch'ao), sometimes known as the Manchu Dynasty, was founded by the Manchu clan Aisin Gioro, in what is today Manchuria expanded into China proper and the surrounding territories of Inner Asia, establishing the Empire of the Great Qing (Chinese: 大清帝國, pinyin: dàqīng dìguó). The Qing was the last Dynasties in Chinese history. Declared as the Later Jin Dynasty in 1616, it changed its name in 1636 to "Qing", and conquered all of China in 1644, ruling it until 1912. In the aftermath of the Xinhai Revolution, a new Republic of China was established and Pu-yi abdicated. "Later Jin" is sometimes spelled "Later Jinn" to distinguish from another Five Dynasties and Ten Kingdoms Period. The Qing Dynasty was founded not by the Han Chinese people who form the overwhelming majority of the population of China proper, but by the Manchus, a semi-nomadic people not even known by that name when they first rose to prominence in what is now northeastern China. Taking advantage of the political instability and popular rebellions convulsing the Ming dynasty, the highly organized military forces of the Manchus swept into the Ming capital of Beijing in 1644, and there remained until the Qing dynasty was overthrown in a Xinhai Revolution in 1911, with the last emperor abdicating early in 1912. Manchu got into antagonism with Han Chinese only as a result of enforcing the "queue order", which forced the Han Chinese to adopt Manchu hairstyle (the pigtail) and Manchu-style clothing. It was designed to massacre both the Han Chinese bodies and their souls, in the physical as well as spiritual sense. During the 268 years of Manchu rule, numerous Chinese rebellions had ocurred because of the strict rule of haircutting. The Manchus had a special hair style: the infamous "queue". They cut hair off the front skull of their head and made the remaining hair into a long pigtail. The pigtail story might be related to the early Tobas of the 4th-6th century. The Tobas were called ''suo lu'', namely, pigtail styled robbers. (A better English wording for 'lu' would be enemies or savages.) The Chinese had no choice, either hair or head to be cut. The traditional Chinese clothing, or Hanfu was also replaced by Manchu-style clothing. Qipao (or Chinese dress) and Tangzhuang, which are usually regarded as traditional Chinese clothing nowadays, are actually Manchu-style clothing. Manchu edited and forged the history of the former dynasty, ''Ming Shi'' (History of Ming Dynasty). One good example would be the claim that Zhang Xianzhong, who was killed in 1646, had made a stone monument entitled "seven killings". Manchu historians tried to cover up their slaughter of Sichuan Chinese as well as to legalize Manchu's rule over China. To be noted would be the dramatic population drop during the Ming-Qing dynastic transition. To further suppress the Chinese intellectuals, Manchu emperors, like Qianlong Emperor of China, resorted to "literary inquisition" (''Wen Zi Yu'', "imprisonment due to writings") for controlling the minds and thoughts of Chinese. ''Wen Zi Yu'' was the law forbidding people writing any words politically. Many people died from Wen Zi Yu by writing some word which is not even political at all. Manchu forbade the assembly of scholars or intellectuals into societies and moreover advocated "eight-part essay" ("stereotyped essay") as the format for imperial civil service exams. Emperor Kangxi commanded the most complete dictionary of Chinese characters ever put together at the time, and under Emperor Qianlong, the compilation of a catalogue of the important works on Chinese culture was made. Thousands of books viewed by Manchu rulers as politically unacceptable were destroyed when compiling the catalogue. The Manchu also adopted predatory methods of land deprivation. They set up Eight Banners system in the attempt of avoiding the possibility of being assimilated into the Chinese. Eight Banners were military institutions set up to provide a structure with which the Manchu `bannermen' were meant to identify. Banner membership was to be based on traditional Manchu skills such as archery, horsemanship, and frugality. In addition, they were encouraged to use the Manchu language, rather than Chinese. Bannermen were given economic and legal privileges in Chinese cities, meaning that they could often avoid working because they had an "iron rice bowl of privilege" under a form of "apartheid". The novel form became widely read and perhaps China's most famous novel, The Chronicles of the Stone, was written in the mid-eighteenth century. The Taiping Rebellion in the mid-nineteenth century was the first major instance of anti-Manchu sentiment threatening the stability of the Qing dynasty, a phenomenon that would only increase in the following years. However, the horrific number of casualties of this rebellion - as many as 30 million people may have died - and the complete devastation of a huge area in the south of the country have to a large extent been overshadowed by another significant conflict. Although not nearly as bloody, the outside world and its ideas and technologies had a tremendous and ultimately revolutionary impact on an increasingly weak and uncertain Qing state. The 268 years of Qing dynasty China saw glorious successes, humiliating defeats, and profound changes to virtually all aspects of life. Today's China has in many ways been shaped by these experiences. The consolidation of Qing power was accompanied by territorial expansion, and the borders of modern China largely reflect successful Qing military campaigns. == Formation of the Manchu state == The Manchu state was formed by Nurhaci in the early 17th century. Originally a vassal of the Ming, he declared himself Emperor of the Later Jin in 1609. In the same year, he expanded the state's economic and human resources as well as technology by enslaving the Chinese inhabitants of Manchuria. In 1625, Nurhaci established his capital at Shenyang (also Shenjing; Manchu Language: Mukden), but the following year he suffered his first major military defeat to the Ming general Yuan Chonghuan. Nurhaci died the same year. One of his most important achievements was the creation of eight banner units responsible for the civil and military administration of all its troops and their families. Nurhaci's successor Huang Taiji (Abahai) continued to build on his father's foundations, incorporating the first Chinese banners into his army. Huang Taiji also adopted many Ming political institutions into his Manchu state, but also provided for Manchu domination of those institutions through a quota system. When Lingdan Khan, the last grand-Khan of the Mongols, died on his way to Tibet in 1634, his son Ejei surrendered to the Manchus and gave the great seal of the Yuan Dynasty to Huang Taiji. In 1636 Huang Taiji renamed the state Qing (pure) suggesting ambitions beyond Manchuria. In a series of military campaigns, he won the submission of Inner Mongolia, Korea and took control of the Amur River (Heilongjiang) region. == The conquest of China == After years of civil unrest, the Ming capital Beijing was sacked by a coalition of rebel forces led by Li Zicheng. The Ming dynasty officially came to an end when the Chongzhen Emperor of China committed suicide by hanging himself on a tree on the hill overlooking the Forbidden City. After taking Beijing in April 1644, Li Zicheng led an army of 60,000 strong to confront Wu Sangui, the general commanding Ming's 100,000 strong garrison guarding Shanhaiguan (山海關). Shanhaiguan is the pivotal northeastern pass of the Great Wall of China located fifty miles northeast of Beijing and for years its defenses were what kept the Manchus at bay and out of China. Wu, caught between two enemies, decided to cast his lots with the Manchus and made an alliance with Prince Dorgon, regent to the then six-year old Emperor Shunzhi, son of Emperor Huang Taiji who had passed away the year before. Together the two armies met Li Zicheng's rebel forces in battle on May 27, 1644. Even though the rebel forces were routed, Wu's army was so weakened by the day's fighting that he had no choice but to join the Manchus forces as they captured Beijing on June 6 and began their conquest of the whole of China. The process took another seventeen years of battling Ming loyalists, pretenders and rebels. The last Ming pretender, Prince of Gui, sought refuge in Burma but was turned over to a Qing expeditionary force headed by Wu Sangui who had him brought back to Yunnan province and executed in early 1662. ==Kangxi and Consolidation== [[Image:Kangxi.jpg|thumb|200px|The Kangxi Emperor (r. 1662 - 1722)]] The Kangxi Emperor (r. 1662 - 1722) assumed the throne at age seven. During the early years of his reign, he was largely aided by his grandmother, the Grand Empress Dowager, Empress Xiaozhuang. The Manchus found controlling their newly won empire a daunting task. The vastness of China's territory meant that there were only enough banner troops to garrison key cities forming the backbone of a defence network that relied heavily on surrendered Ming soldiers. In addition, three surrendered Ming generals were singled out for their contributions to the Qing imperial cause, ennobled as feudal princes (藩王), and given governorships over vast territories in Southern China. The chief of these was Wu Sangui, who was given the provinces of Yunnan, and Guizhou, while generals Shang Kexi (尚可喜) and Geng Zhongming (耿仲明) were given Guangdong and Fujian provinces, respectively. As the years went by, the three feudal lords and their territories inevitably became increasingly autonomous. Finally, in 1673, Shang Kexi petitioned Kangxi Emperor, stating his desire to retire to his home town in Liaodong (遼東) province and nominating his son as his successor. The young emperor granted his retirement but denied the heredity of his fief. In reaction, the two other generals decided to petition for their own retirements to test Kangxi's resolve, thinking that he wouldn't risk offending them. The move backfired as the young emperor called their bluff by accepting their requests and ordering all three fiefdoms to be reverted back to the crown. Faced with the stripping of their powers, Wu Sangui felt he had no choice but to rise up in revolt. He was joined by Geng Zhongming and Shang Kexi's son Shang Zhixin (尚之信). The ensuing rebellion lasted for eight years. At the peak of the rebels' fortunes, they managed to extend their control as far north as the river Changjiang (長江). Ultimately, though, the Qing government was able to put down the rebellion and exert control over all of southern China. The threats, however, weren't all internal. Kangxi Emperor of China personally led China on a series of military campaigns against Tibet, the Jüün Ghar, and later Russia. He arranged the marriage of his daughter to the Khan Gordhun to avoid an invasion. Gordhun's military campaign against the Qing failed, further strengthening the Empire. By the end of the 17th century, China was at its most powerful since the early Yuan Dynasty. Taiwan was also taken by Qing forces in 1683 from Zheng Chenggong's son, Zheng Jing; the former had conquered it from the Netherlands. Kangxi also handled many Jesuit Missionaries that came to China hoping for mass conversions. Although they failed in their attempt, Kangxi still peacefully kept the missionaries in Beijing. Civil order and recognition by the people of Qing was Kangxi's foremost agenda. ==The Yongzheng & Qianlong emperors== Yongzheng Emperor of China (r. 1723 - 1735) and his son Qianlong Emperor of China (r. 1735 - 1796) and their reigns were at the height of Qing power. After Kangxi's death in the winter of 1722, his fourth son, Yinzhen (later to be known as Emperor Yongzheng) succeeded. Yongzheng remained a controversial character because of rumours about him usurping the throne. Nonetheless Yongzheng was a very hardworking ruler. His first big step towards a stronger regime came when he brought the Imperial examination back to its original standards. In 1724 he cracked down on illegal exchange rates of coins, which was being manipulated by officials to fit their financial needs. Yongzheng was known as harsh, and in many ways, ruthless. Yongzheng did show trust in Han officials, and appointed many of his proteges to prestigious positions. Nian Gengyao was appointed to lead a military campaign. Yonzheng's reign saw more consolidation of territory, a toughened stance towards corrupt officials, and the creation of a Military Affairs Department (軍機處). Yongzheng died in 1735, shortly after he ordered his third son, Hongshi, to commit suicide. This was followed by the succession of his son Hongli as the Qianlong Emperor of China. Qianlong was known as an able general. Succeeding the throne at the age of 24, Qianlong personally led the military in campaigns near Xinjiang and Mongolia. Revolts and uprisings in Sichuan and parts of southern China were successfully calmed. Around forty years into Qianlong's reign, the Qing government saw a return of rampant corruption. Officials such as Ho Shen was arguably one of the most corrupt in the entire Qing Dynasty. He was eventually executed by Qianlong's son Jiaqing Emperor of China (r. 1796 - 1820). ==Rebellion, unrest and external pressure== One common view of the 19th century was that it was an era in which Qing control weakened, and prosperity diminished. China suffered massive social strife, economic stagnation, and explosive population growth. Moreover, starting with the reign of the Daoguang Emperor of China (r. 1820–1850), China was increasingly connected to Russia, the West, and later Japan. International and global influence was more freely allowed into the country. Britain's desire to continue its opium trade with China collided with imperial edicts prohibiting the addictive drug, and the First Opium War erupted in 1840. China lost the war; subsequently, Britain and other Western powers, including the United States, occupied "concessions" and gained special commercial privileges. Hong Kong was ceded to Britain in 1842 under the Treaty of Nanking. Sovereign areas already hospitable to informal empire largely avoided formal rule during the shift to New Imperialism. China, for instance, was not a backward country unable to secure the prerequisite stability and security for western-style commerce, but a relatively stable empire unwilling to admit global commerce. The strong nature of China's market helps explain international contentment with informal 'Spheres of Influences'. China notably possessed a securable market without formal control. While China had an inferior negotiation position relative to other large powers, it was a major destination for investment capital. International powers did intervene military there to quell domestic chaos, such as the Taiping Rebellion and the anti-global Boxer Rebellion. For example, General "Chinese" Gordon, later killed by the isolationist Mahdi Army in the Sudan, is often credited as having saved the Manchu dynasty from the Taiping insurrection. Others maintain China was able to save itself, at the cost of millions of civilian casualties. In addition, the Taiping Rebellion (太平起義) (1851-1864), the Nian Rebellion (捻軍起義) (1853-1868) and the Muslim Panthay Rebellion, along with Russian-supported Muslim separatist movements in Gansu province and Xinjiang (also called Chinese Turkestan or East Turkestan), drained Chinese resources and almost toppled the dynasty. Han officials such as Zeng Guofan was sent out to crush the Taiping rebellion, which had gathered a lot of strength over the years. After several failed military campaigns, Zeng Guofan's brother Zeng Guoquan was aband was credited partly to Li Hongzhang's Huai Army. The end to two large revolts, however, did little to ensure stability within the Empire. There was increasing pressure from external powers. [[Image:China_imperialism_cartoon.jpg|thumbnail|250px|In this political cartoon, China is being divided up by the United Kingdom, Germany, Russia, France, and Japan]] ==The Rule of Empress Dowager Cixi== In the late 19th century, a new leader emerged. The Empress Dowager Cixi, concubine to the Xianfeng Emperor (r. 1850-1861), the mother of child emperor Tongzhi Emperor of China, and Aunt of Guangxu Emperor of China successfully controlled the Qing government and was the de facto leader of China for close to 40 years. She staged a coup d'état to oust the regency led by Sushun (Chinese) appointed by the late Emperor. She was known for her "behind the curtain" (垂帘聼政) participation in politics. By the 1860s, the Qing dynasty had put down the rebellions with the help of militia organized by the Chinese gentry. The Qing government then proceeded to deal with problem of modernization, which it attempted with the Self-Strengthening Movement. Several modernized armies were formed including the much renowned Beiyang Army; however the fleets of "Beiyang" were annihilated in the Sino-Japanese War (1894-1895), which produced calls for greater and more extensive reform. After the start of the 20th century, the Qing Dynasty was in a dilemma. It could proceed with reform and thereby alienate the conservative gentry or it could stall reform and thereby alienate the revolutionaries. The Qing Dynasty tried to follow a middle path, but proceeded to alienate everyone. 10 years into the reign of Guangxu Emperor of China (r. 1875 - 1908), western pressure was so big on China that she forcefully gave up all sorts of power. In 1898 Guangxu attempted the Hundred Days' Reform (百日维新/戊戌变法), in which new laws were put in place and some old rules were abolished. Newer, more progressive-minded thinkers like Kang Youwei was trusted and recognized conservative-minded people like Li Hongzhang were removed from high positions. but the ideals were stifled by Cixi and Guangxu was jailed in his own palace. Cixi, on the other hand, only concentrated on her own power and well being. At the occasion of her 60th Birthday she spend over 30 million taels of silver for the decorations & events, an unthinkable amount even by today's terms. In 1901, following the murder of the German Ambassador, the Alliance of Eight Nations (八國聯軍) entered China as a united military force for the second time. Cixi reacted by declaring war on all eight nations, only to see Beijing under their control within a short period of time. Along with the Guangxu Emperor, she fled to Xi'an. As a military compensation, the Alliance listed scores of demands on the Qing Government, including an initial hitlist which had Cixi as No. 1. Li Hongzhang was sent to negotiate and the Alliance backed down from several of the demands. ==Fall of the Dynasty== Mass civil disorder had also begun and continuously grown. Cixi and the Guangxu emperor both died in 1908, leaving a relatively powerless and unstable central authority. The Puyi of Zaifeng, Prince Chun, was appointed successor at age two, leaving Zaifeng with the regency. This was followed by the dismissal of General Yuan Shikai from his former positions of power. In mid 1911 Zaifeng created the "Imperial Family Cabinet", a ruling council of the Imperial Government almost entirely consisting of Aisin Gioro relatives. This brought a wide range of negative opinion from senior officials like Zhang Zhidong. The Wuchang Uprising succeeded on October 10th, 1911, and was followed by a proclamation of a separate central government, the Republic of China, in Nanjing with Sun Yat-sen as its provisional head. Numerous provinces began "separating" from Qing control. Seeing a desperate situation unfold, the Qing government brought an unwilling Yuan Shikai back to military power, taking control of his Beiyang Army, with the initial goal of crushing the revolutionaries. After taking the position of Prime Minister (内阁总理大臣) and creating his own cabinet, Yuan went as far as to ask for the removal of Zaifeng from the regency. This removal later proceeded with directions from Empress Dowager Longyu. With Zaifeng gone, Yuan Shi-kai and his Beiyang commanders effectively dominated Qing politics. He reasoned that going to war would be unreasonable and costly, especially when noting that the Qing Government had a goal for constitutional monarchy. Similarly, Sun Yat-sen's government wanted a Republican constitutional reform, both aiming for the benefit of China's economy and populace. With permission from Empress Dowager Longyu, Yuan began negotiating with Sun Yat-sen, who decided that his goal had been achieved in forming a republic, and that therefore he could allow Yuan to step into the position of President of the Republic. In 1912, after rounds of negotiations, Longyu issued the Imperial Edict bringing about the abdication of the child emperor Puyi. The collapse of the Qing dynasty in 1912 brought an end to over 2000 years of imperial history in China and began an extended period of instability, not just at the national level but in many areas of peoples' lives. Obvious political and economic backwardness combined with widespread criticism of Chinese culture led to questioning and doubt about the future. China's turbulent history since the overthrow of the Qing may be understood at least in part as an attempt to understand and recover significant aspects of historic Chinese culture and integrate them with influential new ideas that have emerged within the last century. The Qing dynasty is the source of much of this magnificent culture, but its perceived humiliations also provide much from which to learn. ==Qing society== Manchu males had the custom of braiding hair into a pigtail known as a queue. During the Qing Dynasty, the Manchus enforced this custom onto the Han Chinese population, and any male who was seen without pigtail outdoors was to be beheaded. ==Qing politics== The most important administrative body of the Qing dynasty was the Grand Council which was a body composed of the emperor and high officials. The Qing dynasty was characterized by a system of dual appointments by which each position in the central government had a Manchu and a Han Chinese assigned to it. During the Qianlong Emperor's reign, for example, members of his family were distinguished by garments with a large circular emblem on the back, whereas a Han could only hope to wear clothing with a square emblem; this meant effectively that any guard in the court could immediately distinguish family members from the back view alone. With respect to Mongolia, Tibet and Eastern Turkestan, the Qing Dynasty maintained a loose system of control, with the Qing emperor acting as Mongol Khan, patron of Tibetan Buddhism and supporter of Muslims and keeping a loose system of control. How this system is best described remains a strong point of controversy because of its current political implications. Supporters of Chinese nationalism argue that Qing rule over these areas is best described as an extremely high degree of autonomy within a single nation-state, while supporters of Tibetan independence argue that the Qing dynasty was a personal union between many nation-states. However, Qing policy changed with the establishment of Xinjiang province in 1884. In response to British and Russian military action in Xinjiang and Tibet, the Qing sent New Army units which performed remarkably well against British units. The abdication of the Manchu Emperor, who had integrated the Empire, inevitably led to the controversy about the status of the Qing outer territories. It was and remains the position of Mongols and Tibetan nationalists, that because they owed allegiance to the Qing monarch in a personal capacity, that with the abdication of the Qing, they owed no allegiance to the Chinese state. This position was rejected by the new Republic of China and subsequent People's Republic of China which have claimed that these areas remained integral parts of China. The Western powers accepted the latter theory, largely in order to prevent a scramble for China. ==Qing military== The development of the Chinese military system during the Qing Dynasty can be divided into two broad periods separated by the Taiping rebellion (1850 - 64). Early Qing military was organized around the Manchu banner system first developed by Nurhachi as a way to organize Manchurian society beyond petty clan affiliations. There were eight banners in all, differentiated by colours. The banners in their order of precedence were as follows: Yellow, Border Yellow, White, Red, Blue, Border White, Border Red, Border Blue. The Yellow, Border Yellow, and White banners were collectively known as the ‘Upper Three Banners’(上三旗) and were under the direct command of the Emperor. Only members of the Upper Three Banners could become the Emperor's personal bodyguards. The remaining banners were known as ‘The Lower Five Banners’ (下五旗) and were each commanded by hereditary princes within the Banner known by the informal title of ‘Iron Cap Princes’ (铁帽子王). Together they formed the ruling council of the entire Manchu nation as well as high command of the Manchurian army. The Iron Cap Princes continued to exercise considerable infleunce over the political and military policies of Qing government until the reign of Emperor Qianglong. As Qing power expanded north of the great wall during the last years of the Ming dynasty, this social military system was expanded by Nurhachi's son and successor Hong Taiji to include parallel Mongolian and Chinese banners. After their conquest of China, the relatively small banner armies were augmented by the Green Standard Army (綠營兵) which outnumbered banner troops by three to one. The Green Standard Army so-named after the colour of their battle standards was made up of ethnic Han Chinese troops who had surrendered to the Manchus during the conquest. They are led by a mixture of Banner and Green Standard officers. The Banners and Green Standard troops were standing armies, paid for by central government. In addition, regional governors from provincial down to village level maintained their own irregular local militias for police duties and disaster relief. These militias were usually granted small annual stipends from regional coffers for part-time service obligations. They received very limited military drill if at all and were not considered combat troops. Banner Armies were divided along ethnic lines, namely Manchurian and Mongolian and subdivided into eight different colour banners each. There existed a third branch of Chinese bannermen which consisted of those who had joined the Manchus before their conquest of China. However these Chinese bannermen were not regarded by the Manchurian Qing government as equal to the other two branches due to their late addition to the Manchu cause as well as their Han Chinese ancestry. The nature of their service - mainly as infantry, artillery and sappers, was also seen as alien to the Manchurian nomadic traditions of fighting as cavalry. After the conquest of China proper the military roles played by Chinese Bannermen were quickly subsumed by the Green Standard Army. The socio-military origins of the Banner system meant that population within each branch and their sub-divisions were hereditary and rigid. Only under special circumstances sanctioned by imperial edict were social movements between banners permitted. In contrast, the Green Standard Army was originally intended to be a professional volunteer force. However during protracted period of peace in China from the 18th to mid 19th centuries, recruits from farming communities dwindled, due partly to Neo-Confucianism's negative stance on military careers. In order to maintain strengths, the Green Standard Army began to internalize, and gradually became hereditary in practice. After the conquest, the approximately 200,000 strong Manchu Banner Army was evenly divided; half was designated the Forbidden Eight Banner Army (jinlubaqi|禁旅八旗)and was stationed in Beijing. It served both as the capital's garrison and Qing government's main strike force. The remainder of the Banner troops was distributed to guard key cities in China. These were known as the Territorial Eight Banner Army (zhufanbaqi|駐防八旗). The Manchu rulers, keenly aware of their own minority status, reinforced a strict policy of racial segregation between the Manchus and Mongols from Han Chinese for fear of their being assimilated by Han culture while living in close proximity with the newly subjugated Han people. This policy applied directly to the Banner garrisons, most of which occupied a separate walled zone within the cities they were stationed at. In cities where there were limitation of space such as in Qingzhou (青州), a new fortified town was purposely erected to house the Banner garrison and their families. Beijing, being the imperial seat, was a special case: the Regent Dorgon ordered the entire Chinese population forcibly relocated to the southern suburbs. The walled city was portioned out to the remaining Manchu eight Banners, each responsibled for guarding a section of the city that surrounded the Forbidden City palace complex(紫禁城). The policy of posting Banner troops as territorial garrison was not to protect but to inspire awe in the subjugated Chinese populace at the expense of their expertise as cavalry. As a result, after a century of peace and lack of training the Territorial Banner troops had deteriorated greatly in their combat worthiness. This is mirrored by a similar if slower decline in the Green Standard Army. In peace time, soldiering became merely a source of supplementary income. Soldiers and commanders alike neglected training in pursuit of their own economic gains. Corruption was rampant as regional commanders submitted pay and supply requisitions based on exaggerated head counts to the quartermaster department and pocketed the difference. When the Taiping Rebellion broke out in 1850s the Qing Court found out belatedly that both the Territorial Banner troops and Green Standards could not on their own put down even local rebellions let alone keep foreign invaders at bay - losing both the first (1839 -1842) and second (1856 -1860) Opium Wars. However to the Qing government the more serious problem was internal. The Qing military forces suffered a series of disastrous defeats at the hands of the Taiping rebels culminating in the loss of the city of Jinling (金陵) - present day Nanjing (南京). The fall of Jinling in 1853 saw the massacre of its entire Manchu garrison and their attached families in the city. Shortly thereafter rebel expeditionary forces penetrated as far north as the suburbs of Tianjin (天津). In desperation the Qing court ordered a Chinese mandarin Zhen Goufan (曾國藩)to reorganize the regional and village militias (Tuanyong|團勇,Xianyong|鄉勇) to contain the Taiping rebels. The force Zhen created became known as "Xiang" Army (湘軍), named after the region it was raised. Xiang Army was a hybrid between local militia force and a standing army. It was better trained and led than local militias, but was paid for in most parts by regional coffers and funds its commanders - mostly Chinese gentries - could muster. Xiang Army and the Huai Army (淮军) that came after it collectively were called Yongying (勇營), a system built on the Neo-Confucian idea of binding the troops' loyalty to their immediate superiors and to the regions which they were raised. This gave the troops, at least in the short term, a higher level of esprit de corp. However in the long run it created more problems for the Qing government. Firstly, the raise of Youngying military system signalled the beginning of the end of Manchu dominance in military matters. Secondly, its command structure fostered cronyism amongst regional (ethnic Han) army commanders and laid the seeds to warlordism. By late 1800s, with China fast descending into a semi colonial state, even the most conservative elements in the Qing court could no longer ignore China's military weakness in contrast to the foreign "barbarians" literally beating down its gates. The advent of western weaponry such as repeating rifles and steam driven dreadnought battleships rendered China's traditionally trained and equipped army and navy useless in face of the invading foreign powers. Attempts were made to reform military institutions and to train certain units in westernized drills, tactics and weaponry. These units were collectively called the New Model Army (新式陸軍). The most successful was the Beiyang Army (北洋軍) under the overall supervision and control of the Chinese general Yuan Shikai (袁世凱), who exploited his position to eventually become the Republic president, dictator and finallly abortive emperor of China. ==Related topics== *List of Emperors of the Qing Dynasty *List of Manchu clans *Manchu official headwear *Mandarin square History of China History of Mongolia History of Manchuria Qing Dynasty nds:Qing-Dynastie
Qing Dynasty
Nanshu: the Qing Emperor was a "supporter of Muslims"? In what way was he a supporter of Uygur and Hui muslims? What were the official Islamic titles confered to him by Uygur and Hui communities? Or did he on his own behalf have a contract of some sort with Uygur and Hui princes and "ahunds"? To what extend did Uygur princes forgo their political connections with the Uzbek, Timurid princes outside of Qing jurisdiction in order to become vassals of the Aisin Gioros? What ethnic-national princely or honorary titles did the Aisin Gioro emperors formally take on? I guess "the governor of the Nakhis" or "the chief of the Nungs" wouldn't be part of them. :I do not know the accurate term, but Turkic Muslims in Eastern Turkestan justified the non-Islamic rule by "duty of salt": man should not betray who granted a faver. User:Nanshu 02:18 Feb 10, 2003 (UTC) --- I changed the first sentence to a form which I think will avoid a political flame and besides is more accurate. The Qing dynasty didn't rule Tibet until 1723 and Xinjiang until the mid 18th century, so stating that they were the ruling dynasty of Tibet and East Turkestan between 1644 and 1912 is inaccurate anyhow. -- User:Roadrunner ----- I changed China to China proper for NPOV reasons. I'm not altogether satisfied with the section on Qing administration of outer areas, because the notion that Qing rule was a personal union is not universally accepted (for obvious political reasons) -- User:Roadrunner --- Reworded statement on Qing rule in outer areas. Also I took out the statement about 1884 marking intervening of Han Chinese into the outer Qing Dynasty. First of all, before 1884, Han Chinese were not simply another subject people, and second the Qing dynasty did intervene in outer regions at various points. Also I have problems with the last sentence but will have to think about how to reword it. -- User:Roadrunner Changed the date from 1636 to 1644. The Manchus did declare a new dynasty in 1636 but they called it the Jin. The Qing dynasty wasn't declared until 1644 after the capture of Beijing. : No. It was in 1616 that the State of Jin was established by Nurhaci. In 1636 his son Hong Taiji declared the new dynasty of Qing in Mukden recommended by the Manchus, Mongols and Chinese. That's why the era name was changed from ''sure han'' to ''wesihun erdemunnge''. So 1636 is correct. -- User:Nanshu :: Thanks!!!! I stand corrected them -- User:Roadrunner ---- Aisin Gioro is the original Manchu spelling, not anglicized name. -- User:Nanshu ---- Are the "Manchu Flagged Factions" mentioned the Banner systems? --~~ ---- Some dates of reign in the table do not match the dates given in the individual articles: * Qianlong Emperor of China * Kangxi Emperor of China ---- == The List == Is that table necessary? I believe there is already an article containing such table. :o --User:Gboy 04:30, 1 Nov 2003 (UTC) :Where? The one with ''all'' the Chinese soveriegns? Some people may have trouble loading that page because it is so long. --User:Jiang 05:29, 1 Nov 2003 (UTC) ::I can't remember. Maybe I am wrong, maybe I confuse that with XXX Emperor of China? But i totally agree with you that that table is really long! Why not split them into several pages? --User:Gboy 05:41, 1 Nov 2003 (UTC) : Perhaps List of rulers of the Qing Dynasty. --User:Menchi 05:46, 1 Nov 2003 (UTC) ::I don;t think that's necessary. The page hasnt reached 32kb yet. --User:Jiang ---- ""If political conditions in a particular overseas markets were stable enough, Britain could ____ its economy through free trade alone without having to resort to formal rule or mercantilism. "" --User:Cylauj 15:03, 29 Apr 2004 (UTC) == Listing of names == It is non-standard to list the different names and romanizations in bullet point format. If you seek to make this standard, then please go propose it at Wikipedia talk:Manual of Style for China-related articles. Otherwise, the standard is to put everything in parenthesis and start the article with a complete introductory sentence. Also, "Empire of the Great Qing" was the official name of the country ruled by the Qing Dynasty. The two are not entirely synonymous. --User:JiangUser talk:Jiang 03:39, 27 Jun 2004 (UTC) :I'm not seeking to change the standard, just address a unique (I think) situation where there are ''five'' alternative names, a situation which demands clarity so as not to confuse the reader. If, however, you think that it is also worth considering adopting bullet points as a standard for all China-related articles to cover Chinese, pinyin, W-G, etc, then I will be happy to make such a suggestion, although it will obviously involve editing an awful lot of articles. As to "Empire of the Great Qing", you are right that it is not synonynous with "Qing dynasty", but it is also not synonymous with "China", as you write. - User:Madw 06:43, Jun 27, 2004 (UTC) I don't think this article deserves an exception to the rule. I don't see how the reader will be confused as along as we use parenthesis and italics. How is this different from four? or three? I don't agree with this format, as it is standard everywhere to begin with a full and complete sentence. During Qing rule, China was referred to diplomatically as the "Empire of the Great Qing" and commonly as the "Chinese Empire" or "Ch'ing Empire". Of course, this referred to the Manchu domains. The term "China" did include all of what the Qing ruled over. China does not and has not always been synonymous with China proper.--User:JiangUser talk:Jiang 07:00, 27 Jun 2004 (UTC) :Surely the priority for all articles must be to make things as clear as possible for the readers, rather than sticking religiously to a particular standard. Maybe your original suggestion of considering adopting such a new, clearer standard for all China-related articles, where multiple alternatives almost always exist, is the way forward. But there are always likely to be exceptions, and in such cases making articles easily understood must always come first IMO. I'd be interested in hearing what others have to say on this matter... :As to "Qing dynasty" being synonymous with "China" - this is just plain wrong. The Qing administration did not take this view, hence the 理藩院 ''Lifanyuan'' and a different system of governance; foreigners did not take this view, hence Manchuria, Mongolia, East Turkestan, Tibet, etc; and the Chinese word 中国 did not include all these territories in its meaning until the arrival of the revolutionary groups at the end of the Qing, as seen in the works of 19th century scholars such as 魏源 Wei Yuan, etc. Making "Qing dynasty" synonymous with "China" is always anachronistic - the ruling house wasn't even Chinese! This is a mistake that we should not be making. - User:Madw 07:50, Jun 27, 2004 (UTC) ::I agree that Making "Qing dynasty" synonymous with "China" is always anachronistic. it is the same case with yuan dynasty.It is ridiculous to say "yuan dynasty" synonymous with "China" because everyone knows that in fact "yuan dynasty" is part of the Mongol Empire. what jiang said is out of political motivation. I've surely seen 19th century maps outlining the Qing Empire but labelled "Chinese Empire". The [http://50.1911encyclopedia.org/C/CH/CHINA.htm 1911 EB] article discusses all of the Qing Empire, and phrases it "''CHINA, a country of eastern Asia, the principal division of the Chinese empire. In addition to China proper the Chinese Empire includes Manchuria, Mongolia, Tibet and Sin-kiang (East Turkestan, Kulja, Dzungaria, &c., i.e. all the Chinese dependencies lying between. Mongolia on the north and Tibet on the south).''" Ditto for the [http://www.newadvent.org/cathen/03663b.htm Catholic Encyclopedia]: "''The Chinese Empire, the largest political division of Eastern Asia, extends from 18°10' to 53°45' N. lat., and from 73°47' to 134°25' E. long. It includes China proper or the Eighteen Provinces (Shi-pa-sheng), theoretically a subject territory of Manchuria, the cradle of the present dynasty, and the dependencies: Mongolia, Ili (or Sin-kiang), and Tibet.''" The ruling house wasn't ''Han'' Chinese. But anyhow, we don't need to assert or imply any of this and I think the current wording is fine. I do not believe obscuring the opening sentence of this articles with transliterations and translations the average Chinese/Manchu-illiterate reader could care less about makes the article clearer. I do not see how putting these in parenthesis makes the text incomprehensible. If there's not much difference, it is my opinion to go by the standard. What do you think should be the convention for breaking names into bullets? How many entries? Maybe we can have a full section of names like at Sun Yat-sen, but that requires more than mere translations/transliterations.--User:JiangUser talk:Jiang 10:50, 27 Jun 2004 (UTC) :We are going to be in serious trouble if we start writing our Asian history articles according to what century-old Western texts say! I would be happy to point you to more recent and relevant source material if that would be of help. :As for the organization of the opening, it is the ''current'' standard that "obscur[es] the opening sentence" and that is the reason for considering something different. We need to make it easier for the Chinese/Manchu-illiterate reader to read the first sentence. You mention the Sun Yat-sen article - well it's beginning is a mess. It doesn't know whether the names should be in the intro or the names section. :You asked my opinion, well look at the Sun article and you will see the changes I would make. As I think about it, there are 2 issues - Chinese/romanization and alternative names. Every article will have Chinese/romanization but alternative names will usually be restricted to people. For me it is very important to make the article highly readable, especially the introduction. I would therefore include romanization in parentheses directly under the title of the article and separated from the intro text. After the introductory text, a list of recognized (not obscure) alternative names could be introduced so that if the reader has come to the page looking for one of these names, perhaps via a redirect, it will be clear that they are in the right place. After all, we have to help the reader find the information they came looking for. For most people, the info would include xing, ming, zi, and hao, with rulers being a little different. If there were only one alternative name, it may be more appropriate to include this in the introductory text - common sense will dictate. It seems to me that this satisfies all important criteria - provides the relevant info but still in a highly readable format. So I guess, the more I think about it, yes, I do think a new standard would be better for China-related articles, and I will probably suggest such on the relevant page when I can get around to it. In the meantime, I have changed this page again to reflect latest thinking. That's my opinion anyway... - User:Madw 16:53, Jun 27, 2004 (UTC) If the stuff in the parenthesis is too long, then I suggest abbreviating (as you have done here) or compacting (as has been done at Deng Xiaoping). Once you copy the second part of your post over to the MoS page, I will respond to your points there. I disagree with some of your points but agree with others. In the meantime, we will go by the current standards as there is no consensus to change it. As for the emperors having a whole bunch of names, I think we should give them each biographical taxoboxes, like every Prime Minister of the United Kingdom (as opposed to having a wide box at the bottom). We can make each of their names a line in the box. Or maybe we can extend this to every Chinese person with a whole bunch of names...but this can be discussed at the Chinese MoS too. Let me know here what you think about adding it to the emperors though. --User:JiangUser talk:Jiang 21:48, 27 Jun 2004 (UTC) :I will address emperors later - it is a problem that I have already given some thought to. I have added my comments to the MoS page, and the discussion can continue there. - User:Madw 01:45, Jun 28, 2004 (UTC) General request: For the time being, please do not change the style of the introduction for this article as it is currently the subject of discussion at Wikipedia talk:Manual of Style for China-related articles. Thank-you - User:Madw 01:45, Jun 28, 2004 (UTC) :Aside from noting that the format should not be changed short of consensus, there are other reasons I made the changes I did. The sentence "
Qing Dynasty
Qing Dynasty and all its related articles. History of China History of Mongolia History of Manchuria Royal families
Qing dynasty
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