[[Image:A-simpson-shadow-sitting.jpg|frame|right|Ashlee Simpson in her "Shadow (song)" music video (2004)]] Ashlee Nicole Simpson (born October 3, 1984 in Dallas, Texas) is an United States singer, actress and the younger sister of singer Jessica Simpson. She rose to prominence in mid-2004, when her first album, the now RIAA certification ''Autobiography (Ashlee Simpson album)'', Debut album at number one in sales, accompanied by a successful reality television, ''The Ashlee Simpson Show''. In October 2004, she was caught lip sync to a pre-recorded studio track on the sketch comedy show ''Saturday Night Live''; this highly publicized incident drew substantial negative attention from the Journalism. ==Early career== Simpson, the daughter of Joe Simpson (manager) and Tina Simpson, was born and raised in Texas, where she was homeschooling by her mother. While her sister Jessica Simpson, four years older, displayed an early talent for singing, Ashlee danced from the age of three and was admitted to the School of American Ballet in New York City at age 11.Ashlee Simpson#Notes and references After her sister Jessica signed a record deal, the family moved to Los Angeles, California, where Ashlee began auditioning for television commercials—her first commercial was for the department store Kohl's.Ashlee Simpson#Notes and references Jessica achieved success in pop music in 1999 with her song "I Wanna Love You Forever" and the album ''Sweet Kisses'', and Ashlee became a backup dancer in Jessica's concerts. She also appeared in an episode of the television situation comedy ''Malcolm in the Middle'' and had a minor role in the 2002 movie ''The Hot Chick'', a comedy starring Rob Schneider. Simpson played the character Cecilia on the television show ''7th Heaven'' from 2002 until the beginning of her singing career in 2004, at which point she stopped regular appearances. ==Music and film== In 2003, Simpson recorded a song, "Just Let Me Cry," for the soundtrack to the movie ''Freaky Friday'', and also signed a record deal with Geffen Records. She recorded an album, ''Autobiography'', released in the U.S. on July 20, 2004. It debuted at number one on the Billboard 200 chart and was certified triple RIAA certification in September 2004. The single (music) "Pieces of Me" preceded the album, was one of the most widely-played songs in the U.S. in mid-2004, and sold well internationally. The next single, "Shadow (song)", was less successful and not released in the U.K. The U.K.-sourced "La La (song)" single followed in 2005. Simpson and her music career were the subject of ''The Ashlee Simpson Show'', a successful reality show on MTV. She had previously appeared on ''Newlyweds'', an already successful reality show about the married life of Jessica and her husband Nick Lachey, and ''The Ashlee Simpson Show'' aired in the subsequent time slot. The show ran in the U.S. for eight weekly episodes from June 16 until August 4, 2004, and dealt with the process of writing, recording, and performing, and with aspects of Simpson's personal life. The first episode of the second season aired in the U.S. on January 26, 2005. Simpson performs live with a backing band, which consists of Ray Brady (guitar), Braxton Olita (guitar), Zach Kennedy (bass guitar), Lucy Walsh (keyboards and vocals) and Chris Fox (drums). On September 29, 2004, she announced on her website that the band would be named "Ashlee Simpson and Submission," taking the name from the fact that they had received so many submissions of proposals for the name. Her manager is her father, Joe Simpson. At the August 8, 2004 Teen Choice Awards show, Simpson received the "Song of the Summer" award for "Pieces of Me," as well as the "Fresh Face" award. She performed "Pieces of Me" during the pre-show for the 2004 MTV Video Music Awards on August 29, and during the actual show she presented an award with Tony Hawk for "Best New Artist in a Video." In December of the same year, she won a Billboard Award for New Female Artist of the Year. Ashlee and her sister Jessica recorded a duet (music) of the Christmas song "Little Drummer Boy" together for ''Rejoyce: The Christmas Album'', a 2004 Christmas album by Jessica; they sang the song together during "Nick & Jessica's Family Christmas", a variety show special which aired on American Broadcasting Company on December 1. [http://abc.go.com/specials/nickjess_xmas.html] Ashlee also sang "Christmas Past, Present, and Future" on the 2004 holiday album ''Radio Disney Jingle Jams''. Simpson has a role in the upcoming movie ''Undiscovered'' (originally titled ''Wannabe''), which began filming in November. She cut her hair shorter for her role as Clea, an aspiring actress and "tomboy". The Lions Gate Films property is directed by Meiert Avis and is described as a "romantic comedy film". [http://www.mtv.com/movies/news/articles/1493864/11182004/story.jhtml] She was shown talking about the film on its set in a segment on ''Total Request Live'' on November 30. ==Style and personal life== Ashlee has a somewhat more rebellious and rock-oriented image than that of her sister. Previously blonde like Jessica, she dyed her hair dark during the recording of the reality show (in the fifth episode), after she had finished filming for ''7th Heaven''. Ashlee's songs also have rock elements absent from her sister's music. Her vocals, while generally not thought to equal her sister's range, have been praised by some as fitting the style of her music, and are sometimes described (positively or negatively) as raspy. Simpson often wears shirts with "punk"-style designs and typically has her fingernails painted black. She has refused to discuss her sex life, in contrast to Jessica, who openly stated her intention to remain a virginity until marriage. "I decided that I didn't want to talk about that because it's super personal," she has said.Ashlee Simpson#Notes and references Ashlee got a tattoo of a star on her left wrist after the release of her album, and another tattoo of two cherries was seen on her ankle in 2005. [http://www.mtv.com/bands/s/simpson_ashlee/news_feature_050328/] Simpson's relationship with Josh Henderson, who had previously appeared on ''Popstars'', lasted about two years and ended during the first episode of ''The Ashlee Simpson Show''. Soon she began her relationship with Ryan Cabrera, a musician who also released his debut album in 2004; this relationship also featured in the reality show (particularly in episodes three and four of the first season), and Simpson appeared in the music video for Cabrera's song "On the Way Down" as Cabrera's love interest. The two were reported to have split up in August 2004 due to their busy schedules, but they were still sometimes seen together in the months that followed, and in the first episode of the second season of ''The Ashlee Simpson Show'', Simpson indicated that they had resumed their relationship. In October 2004, they did a series of concerts at high schools together, and this was shown in the second episode of the reality show's second season. Simpson and her sister Jessica were tied for third on Mr. Blackwell's list of the worst-dressed celebrities of 2004. Blackwell wrote that "from gaudy to grim to downright frenetic these two prove that bad taste is positively genetic." In early May 2005, Ashlee cut her hair short and dyed it a shade of light brown with blonde highlights. On June 19, she appeared at the MuchMusic Video Awards, where she performed "La La", with fully blonde (and longer) hair. ==''Saturday Night Live'' incident== Simpson appeared on ''Saturday Night Live'' as a musical guest on October 24, 2004. As is customary for musical guests, she was scheduled to give two performances, the first of "Pieces of Me" and the second of "Autobiography." As she was beginning the second performance, however, a recording of "Pieces of Me" - including vocals - started playing before she had raised the microphone to her mouth. Simpson, uncertain of how to react, danced nervously (as she later called it, a "hoe-down") and then left the stage. After an emergency television commercial, she appeared again during the show's closing with the guest host of the night, Jude Law, and apologized, saying that her band had started playing the wrong song. Others, however, criticized her for what they saw as evidence that she was lip synching. On Monday, October 25, Simpson called in to ''Total Request Live'', a widely-viewed U.S. top ten music video show, and explained that she had been having trouble with her vocal cords due to acid reflux and could not sing well, and thus had no choice but to perform with a guide track. For the second performance, Simpson said that her drummer had hit the wrong button and consequently the wrong track played. Prior to the incident, Simpson expressed her distaste with lip synching in an interview with ''Lucky (magazine)'' magazine: "I'm totally against it and offended by it. I'm going out to let my real talent show, not to just stand there and dance around. Personally, I'd never lip-synch. It's just not me." During the October 25, 2004 Radio Music Awards broadcast, Simpson made fun of the ''SNL'' mistake by pretending at first to be caught in the same mistake with "Pieces of Me" as before, before saying "Just kidding, you guys!" and going into a performance of "Autobiography." On the morning of October 26, she discussed the incident with Katie Couric on ''The Today Show'', and on October 31, the CBS news program ''60 Minutes'' aired footage from Simpson's rehearsals before the ''SNL'' performance, in which she was shown having trouble with her voice and being visibly upset. ==In 2005== Simpson began her first U.S. headlining tour on February 16, 2005, in Anaheim, California, [http://www.mtv.com/news/articles/1497210/20050217/simpson_ashlee.jhtml?headlines=true] and it ended in Grand Prairie, Texas on April 20. During the tour, she performed three cover songs in addition to her usual ''Autobiography'' songs: The Pretenders' "Brass in Pocket", Blondie (band)'s "Call Me", and Madonna (entertainer)'s "Burning Up". Her opening acts were Pepper's Ghost (band) and The Click Five; she performed a generally consistent setlist, beginning with "Autobiography" and ending with "La La", then returning to the stage to sing "Pieces of Me" in a white dress as an encore. She also included the unreleased song "Hollywood" in her setlists. In a ''TRL'' appearance on February 7, in which she talked about the tour prior to its start, she said that she planned to work on her next album with her band while touring, and that the next album might be released around Fall 2005. Elsewhere, she said that the tour would be "stripped down", without pyrotechnics, and that "it's going to be me and my band getting out there and having fun." [http://www.cincypost.com/2005/03/08/ashlee030805.html] Simpson was on the cover of the February 2005 issue of ''Cosmopolitan (magazine)'' magazine, [http://www.ashleemedia.net/displayimage.php?album=435&pos=0] and she was chosen as its "Fun Fearless Female of the Year". [http://www.ashleemedia.net/displayimage.php?album=435&pos=2] In March 2005, Simpson stated that she would like to incorporate the feel of 1980s music on her second album, and that it would focus less on relationships and more on herself. She also said that she wanted to do another television show, but that ''The Ashlee Simpson Show'' would conclude at the end of its second season, [http://www.mtv.com/news/articles/1499052/20050325/simpson_ashlee.jhtml?headlines=true] the tenth and last episode of which aired on March 30. On the April 24, 2005 episode of ''Punk'd'', Ashton Kutcher and his crew members set up a fake art museum and arranged for Simpson to visit it. They then convinced Simpson that her friend's jacket had caught fire due to being placed near a candle, causing the overhead sprinklers to go off, and ruining all the paintings in the room. In June 2005, Simpson claims she denied accusations that she, Jessica Simpson, and actress Lindsay Lohan got into a catfight at the post-party of the 2005 MTV Movie Awards and said that Lohan claimed that Simpson stole her ex-boyfriend, ''That 70s Show star Wilmer Valderrama. ==Controversial incidents== On January 4, 2005, Simpson performed "La La" at the halftime show for the Orange Bowl in Miami, Florida. When her performance was finished, many of the 72,000-plus spectators booed.[http://www.local10.com/entertainment/4048912/detail.html][http://www.mtv.com/news/articles/1495731/20050111/index.jhtml?headlines=true] Various explanations for the booing have been suggested: that it may have been a belated reaction to the ''SNL'' incident or a distaste for Simpson's singing (some claimed that her voice during the performance was poor and off-key). Or, it may have simply been dissatisfaction with the half-time show as a whole, which has been viewed in recent years as "too MTV" (a negative for the target audience). In January, an Internet petition at petitiononline.com [http://www.petitiononline.com/StopAsh/petition.html] complaining about Simpson's singing was among the most active of the site's petitions. [http://launch.yahoo.com/read/news/14285421] Simpson later said about the petition that "an 18-year-old girl started it, and that's cool. You don't always have to be a fan of everybody's music." She also mentioned the support she has received from her "amazing fans". [http://www.sunherald.com/mld/thesunherald/entertainment/11036610.htm] Also in early 2005, Simpson's marketing campaign was accused of astroturfing on various websites. A post on Metafilter claims that the marketing company posted the same text under the user name "mandyc19" on over three hundred different music-related forums. [http://www.metafilter.com/mefi/38963] ==Trivia== * As a guest on a European television show she participated in a "Keepin' it Real" segment where she was tested on common knowledge. She was unable to state the cost of a carton of milk, nor could she name the capital of Spain or what the employment position of Condoleezza Rice was. This was featured in episode eight of season two of ''The Ashlee Simpson Show''. ==Discography== *"Pieces of Me", single (music), June 29 2004 in music *''Autobiography (Ashlee Simpson album)'', album, July 20 2004 in music *"Shadow (song)", single, November 8 2004 in music (Australia), December 20 2004 in music (Europe) *"La La (song)", single, January 24 2005 in music ==Notes and references== # Although the minimum age for admission was technically 12, Joe Simpson said that he lied about his daughter's age to get her into the school in an October 2004 interview. (Leeds, Jeff. ''The New York Times'', [http://query.nytimes.com/gst/abstract.html?res=F60C12FA3F5C0C708CDDA90994DC404482&incamp=archive:search "Who Wants to Be a New Simpson?",] October 3, 2004.) # Brown, Janelle. ''Seventeen'', [http://www.ashleemedia.net/displayimage.php?album=334&pos=4 "Ashlee Simpson".] November 2004, pages 86–89. # Adams, Patty. ''YM'', [http://www.ashleemedia.net/displayimage.php?album=207&pos=3 "The Sister Who Rocks".] September 2004, pages 112–117. ==Vocal Profile== *Voice type: Spinto Contralto *Highest note: E5 *Lowest note: E3 *Vocal range: 2 octaves ==External links== * [http://www.ashleesimpsonmusic.com Official site] * * [http://www.nndb.com/people/886/000052730/ Ashlee Simpson] at Notable Names Database ; Fan sites * [http://www.ashlee.us ashlee.us] * [http://ashleesimpsonfan.org/index.php ashleesimpsonfan.org] * [http://www.ashlee.de/gallery Multimedia site] (in German) * [http://ashleesimpson.wikicities.com Ashlee Simpson wiki] at Wikicities ; "Anti" sites * [http://www.lipsync.us lipsync.us] * [http://ashlee.zap.to ashlee.zap.to] * [http://www.thesmokinggun.com/archive/0408051_ashlee_simpson_1.html The Smoking Gun: ''Secret of Ashlee Simpson's Success''] ;''SNL'' incident videos: * [http://media.ebaumsworld.com/ashlee-snl.wmv WMV] * [http://www.lipsync.us/ashlee%20goofs.rm RealVideo] * [http://www.lipsync.us/ashlee_simpson_snl10232004.mpg MPEG] Female singers American actors American singers Pop singers Rock singers 1984 births Baptists People from Texas
Image:Ashlee_Couch.jpeg is this fair use? The photo on currently is a press photo for Jay Leno, but this looks like its by 17 Magazine or something. -- user:zanimum :I don't know what the status is, I didn't add it. It's from her album photoshoot, but since it isn't the album cover I don't know if it could be argued as fair use. User:Everyking 16:42, 27 Sep 2004 (UTC) :Bwahahah. I was watching SNL tonight and Ashlee Simpson came on for her first song and I was like "This girl cannot sing. This is going to suck." Then she sounded so perfect and I said "I'm telling you now, she's lip synching." And my friend said I was just hatin' on her. And then she comes out for the second number and fucks it all up! Fan-TASTIC! Loved it. User:Pacian 14:57, 24 Oct 2004 (UTC) ::Well, isn't that special. User:Everyking 15:08, 24 Oct 2004 (UTC) ::Dear teacup, here's your storm of the day. zzzzz User:GRAHAMUK This article is one-sided. How should I fix it? Adding another viewpoint didn't solve it. Am I suppose to just remove the unsupported statements and adjectives? Well, what? Do I need to actually make the removals to get anyone's help on this? Well, if nobody answers in 15 minutes, I'll make the edits and see if anyone has any help on this issue. :Tell me what isn't neutral, then. If I write that Ashlee is wonderful and you write in the next sentence that she's terrible, we certainly don't have Wikipedia:NPOV then, do we? Your edit was nothing but extremely hostile POV. Furthermore, I don't really know what more should be said about the SNL incident. I think what I've written covers it pretty well. User:Everyking 02:24, 28 Oct 2004 (UTC) It states: "although these are not uncommon techniques and have reportedly been used on SNL in the past.". There are no references or sources cited to back this up. It makes the incident misleading, giving the impression that other performers have attempted this, yet no evidence has been cited. :I could cite common knowledge, I suppose, but [http://news.yahoo.com/news?tmpl=story&u=/ap/20041024/ap_en_tv/people_ashlee_simpson_3 here], an AP story about the incident which mentions that. User:Everyking 02:30, 28 Oct 2004 (UTC) ::Please cite it then. Not everyone who reads the article knows about musical guests on a particular show. Seems suspicious though, an anonymous "insider". :::Fine, then, I cited it. Eventually Yahoo will take the article down, though, so it's only a temporary solution. And you can have all the suspicions you want; it's common knowledge that most singers use a guide vocal or lip sync on occasion, if not more frequently than that. Graham's point below is well taken, but it is being treated as notable so I suppose it deserves a reasonable level of detail. User:Everyking 02:39, 28 Oct 2004 (UTC) ::::Thank you. :::::If you watched the 60 minutes show, the producer clearly said that he has never seen anyone lip syncing in SNL. The statement: "although these are not uncommon techniques and have reportedly been used on SNL in the past." is unsupported and biased. The SNL incident should be written as it is. If it is a common knowledge that backing vocal tape is being used then there's no point of having it mentioned in the article at all isn't it? ::::::Thank you for registering your opinion. Everything in the article pertaining to the incident is just fine, however. User:Everyking 06:30, 22 Nov 2004 (UTC) :::::::Actually, there was a clip of Eminem on VH1 a week later on SNL who did the exact same thing on a much smaller scale. He could be heard singing when his lips weren't moving and his mic was down by his waist. There's your proof, there's your example. It's not hearsay or from an unknown source. It's something you can see firsthand, although the press didn't make a big deal out of it since Eminem is less outspoken about his image. User:Chiharu ''Furthermore, I don't really know what more should be said about the SNL incident'' Nothing MORE should be said about it. A lot LESS could be said about it. Christ, what a total storm in a teacup. Anyon ewould think this had some importance, or something. Why not just cut the whole section down to about one line? It's all it needs. User:GRAHAMUK 02:35, 28 Oct 2004 (UTC) ---- It says her age is 20, but I recall reading an AP story that cited her as 19, and in an SNL skit last night, they called her "not quite twenty". So, what's her age? User:TheCustomOfLife 01:40, Nov 1, 2004 (UTC) :She definitely turned 20 on October 3. I'm right, they're wrong. What's the AP worth when you've got Wikipedia? User:Everyking 02:30, 1 Nov 2004 (UTC) == Awards and Music sections == The music section is awfully large and, at the rate of User:Everyking prodigious editing, only going to grow further. I'd keep Awards separate. (Also, she could concievably get a nomination or award for her reality show or acting, or some sort of Razzie-type award for the SNL incident, or some Most Beautiful Person nod from a major publication, or so on...) User:Samaritan 14:58, 14 Dec 2004 (UTC) == Orange Bowl == Hey, this might be something to add. http://www.local10.com/entertainment/4048912/detail.html My dear Everyking, as abusive edit summaries are one of the lengthy charges listed against you in the current RfC, I would avoid making even more of them. Also, over 15,000 signatures in a mere 10 days is not "nonnotable", and certainly does something to balance out the "rah rah Ashlee" attitude that pervades this article. User:ReeneUser talk:Reene 08:41, Jan 15, 2005 (UTC) :My comment was referring to something as garbage. It was directed at the petition, not at the person who added it. And I submit that the petition is indeed nonnotable. It's the internet. It's probably 100 losers who have signed it again and again. I voted to delete the article on the "Gay Nigger Association of America", too. Trolling is almost always nonnotable, aside from a few general articles on the phenomenon. User:Everyking 08:52, 15 Jan 2005 (UTC) ::Something is not trolling simply because you disagree with it. Your comment, however, was abusive: "you've got some nerve, removing the quote while adding that nonnotable garbage." It is not the first time you have called an edit you did not like "garbage" or "nonsense" or what-have-you. And if you do indeed have proof that most or even half of those 15,000 signatures are made by the same person or group of people, please present it. User:ReeneUser talk:Reene 08:58, Jan 15, 2005 (UTC) I suppose I don't have proof, Reene. It looks like you've caught me. User:Everyking 09:01, 15 Jan 2005 (UTC) :If you had looked at the petition, each signature usually includes a quote or reason for signing. Duplicate signatures happen, but since a unique email address is required for each one and most people bothered to type out their unique reason for signing, I don't see how this petition could possibly have been signed by under 15,000 people (there are currently over 20,000 signatures). User:Silsor 19:30, Jan 15, 2005 (UTC) ==Early career information== Everyking, please explain this to me: how is the fact that Ashlee Simpson got her mouth washed out with soap and her Alanis album taken away at all encyclopedic, notable, or even interesting? ''This is not important.'' Neither is the fact that Ashlee Simpson jumped up on a bed and talked on a phone in a commercial -- aren't we talking about her career ''now'', not her career as a spokesgirl for Kohl's? I'm really at a loss here. Is all of the information in this article equally valuable? User:Madame Sosostris 22:06, 16 Jan 2005 (UTC) :Um, no, it's a biographical article, we're talking about her life in general. If you want an article just about the present period in her life, feel free to create one. User:Everyking 22:12, 16 Jan 2005 (UTC) ::The details of most public figures' childhoods are non-notable (with exceptions -- Michael Jackson, for instance, or perhaps Leopold von Sacher-Masoch). This ''is'' a biographical article, but the ''notable'' part of Ashlee's life is her career, not her upbringing. Most biographers spend far less time on their subjects' early lives, simply because most children do little that can be considered memorable. Just as an example, I've got Lord Blake's biography of Disraeli here, which clocks in at over seven hundred pages, and barely fifteen of those are spent on the years from birth until age seventeen. Even if she is a notable person, not every part of her life is important enough for inclusion in a general encyclopedia. Were we creating a fansite for teen idols, then these things would be more relevant. User:Madame Sosostris 22:38, 16 Jan 2005 (UTC) :::The Alanis/soap story is notable because she frequently tells it in interviews, and because it reflects on her early musical interests and influences. The Kohl's thing is notable because it was her first TV commercial. Both will be restored at the earliest available opportunity if they are removed. User:Everyking 23:06, 16 Jan 2005 (UTC) ::::I agree with Everyking on keeping those two pieces somewhere. The ad does help answer the question "how did she get onto TV anyway?" The Alanis thing should get a mention too. If it doesn't fit well into this article, it at least belongs in the influences section of the Autobiography album because stories like that are supposed to be the premise. User:IMeowbot~User talk:IMeowbot :::::I think you could cite Morrisette as an influence on the album, but I don't see why the whole story (with the soap and all) needs to be in there. A 'brief' mention of the commercial -- like, five words or so -- would be fine as well. Every word counts in these situations, and I think things ought to be as streamlined as possible, since these articles are already pretty damn big. User:Madame Sosostris 07:25, 17 Jan 2005 (UTC) ::::::Yep. I moved Alanis (sans soap) into Autobiography, and put in a reference to the YM article. I see that the ad is still mentioned in the current rev of this article. User:IMeowbot~User talk:IMeowbot 07:30, 17 Jan 2005 (UTC) == Discography == I've been checking out this article and the link to her album and I noticed that there are also articles linked from that page about her singles. I was curious if putting up some sort of Discography section on this page would not be helpful. Just a thought, but I worked out a preliminary one below so feel free to build on it or put it up, or let me know if I can! Thanks User talk:Cbing01 User:Cbing01 21:09, 17 Jan 2005 (UTC) :==Discography== :*''Pieces of Me'', single (music), June 29 2004 in music :*''Autobiography (Ashlee Simpson album)'', Album, July 20 2004 in music :*''Shadow (song)'', single, November 8 2004 in music (Australia), December 20 2004 in music (Europe) :*''La La (song)'', single, January 24 2005 in music (tentative) ::Yes, that's entirely consistent with the direction these article need to move. The occasional editor erroneously pushes for brevity at all costs, but the substantive issue is making sure that the articles are readable and genuinely informative. This is substance, not fluff, and matches what is done with other music articles, so I'll move it over. Thanks! User:IMeowbot~User talk:IMeowbot 23:01, 17 Jan 2005 (UTC) I no longer wish to edit this article or be actively involved in it. I may make occasional edits or updates, but I am withdrawing from active participation and removing it from my watchlist. User:Everyking 05:20, 18 Jan 2005 (UTC) I wanted to update some information on her tour, but apparently information on the tour is no longer available on anywhere on Wikipedia. I am baffled. Even User:Ambi told me I should add ''more'' info on her concerts, and you have removed it entirely? User:Everyking 02:02, 19 Jan 2005 (UTC) :The last sentence of Autobiography promotion and publicity notes the projected tour dates -- that's where I figured it belonged (since it falls under the heading of promotion). There wasn't much more information than that to begin with, as I recall. User:Madame Sosostris 07:20, 19 Jan 2005 (UTC) ::And that article will soon be deleted. Please change the start date to 2/16 from 2/18, as I am voluntarily barred from editing it per my agreement with Zen. User:Everyking 07:36, 19 Jan 2005 (UTC) :IMO, some info about tour(s) (as well as seriously notable specific shows) should go on Autobiography (Ashlee Simpson album), whereas a very short synopsis of the tour(s) should go on Ashlee Simpson and/or any other related articles as a bullet list or something similar. I personally have no objection to something like this being added; I can't speak for other editors though. User:ReeneUser talk:Reene 02:45, Jan 19, 2005 (UTC) ::Of course there's no information about the tour yet, because the tour is in the future. Wikipedia is not an advertising medium, nor is it a place to speculate on future events. For marketing and ticket sales, see http:;//ashleesimpsonmusic.com . User:IMeowbot~User talk:IMeowbot 03:04, 19 Jan 2005 (UTC) :::To be fair, I see events that have yet to happen being included in articles all the time. I myself have done so. I think there's something in the manual of style about it. Is there a problem with simply listing the start and finish date of the tour for now? User:ReeneUser talk:Reene 03:18, Jan 19, 2005 (UTC) :::If it stays extremely basic - country, opening date, closing month -- that would be reasonable. A list of anticipated venues would be crossing the line, though. Not only does that come across as ticket marketing, but those dates aren't all even final yet. Some venues are still subject to change depending on advance sales results, the length of the tour is still elastic, and acts and billing are still being negotiated. One interesting tidbit is about who is ''not'' running this tour. If this works out and anyone speaks on the record about why, that would be notable as part of a sea change. User:IMeowbot~User talk:IMeowbot 03:39, 19 Jan 2005 (UTC) ::::Well, you've got me curious, what do you mean? User:Everyking 06:16, 19 Jan 2005 (UTC) :::Just adding a bit in general here, that note about "on the record" is the reason why the Ashlee Simpson articles have seemed bloaty, and other music articles tend to be short. Pop performers' interviews are so heavily coached, and details like biographical information so heavily filtered through press offices, that they give wildly distorted versions of reality. The official history of some of those songs is hilarious, for example, given that some were shopped as demos well before Ashlee wrote them. The previous aborted album projects are also conspicuously missing. Simply put, official information isn't reliable. User:IMeowbot~User talk:IMeowbot 05:00, 19 Jan 2005 (UTC) == :Image:Tv jay leno guest ashley simpson.jpg == No fair use justification is given for this image, and it's not a screen shot. I'm going to make an actual screen grab from Leno to replace this. This photo can always go back later if an adequate justification can be made. User:IMeowbot~User talk:IMeowbot 22:22, 21 Jan 2005 (UTC) :Oh well, couldn't get a decent frame from the Leno broadcast (cameras only zoomed in when the mic was covering her face) but found a reasonable pose from the beginning of the Shadow video. We have a consistent policy for screen caps, so this should be okay. User:IMeowbot~User talk:IMeowbot 01:05, 22 Jan 2005 (UTC) ==Quotes== If you're looking for more quotes to add to the article, here's a good one from today's paper: :In a column in the Spokesman-Review on ghost hunting, Doug Clark ponders the popularity of Ashlee among the deceased: "Is Ashlee Simpson as annoying and talent-impared to the dead as she is to the living?" --User:Carnildo 03:32, 28 Jan 2005 (UTC) :We have a whole encyclopedia here to work on. I'm sure you can find something better to do than taking jabs at me. User:Everyking 03:39, 28 Jan 2005 (UTC) ::I don't think an insult to Ashlee Simpson constitutes a direct insult to you. Besides, there has been a higher incidence of anti-Ashlee quotes in the media of late; just yesterday I saw one (I think it was in the USA Today) that was even nastier than this. There may have to be a Backlash section before too long. User:Madame Sosostris 06:06, 28 Jan 2005 (UTC) Everyking, you really need to step back from this. If you think that somebody reporting an anti-Ashlee quote is an insult to ''you'', then it's clear that you've invested too much in her. User:RickKUser talk:RickK 06:30, Jan 28, 2005 (UTC) :Oh, come on. It was obviously intended to irritate me. User:Everyking 10:58, 28 Jan 2005 (UTC) The recently added image is not the cover of her album (perhaps in another country? I doubt it, but maybe). It's a picture from her album photo shoot, but it's not actually used in the album artwork. I don't know how we should label it, but currently it's not accurate. User:Everyking 11:08, 28 Jan 2005 (UTC) : :Image:Ashlee.jpg is a home-made picture. The text isn't properly anti-aliased, and it's Courier rather than the standard dot matrix logo. User:IMeowbot~User talk:IMeowbot 12:43, 28 Jan 2005 (UTC) Someone remove the petition from Ext. links. It's already in the text. Linking it twice is spamming. User:Everyking 15:26, 28 Jan 2005 (UTC) == Ha == Everyking, with [http://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=Ashlee_Simpson&diff=9752816&oldid=9752797 this edit] you appear to be removing facts and information. Your edit summary says 'trim some cruft'. Isn't this contrary to everything you've been arguing for? Or does your position only apply to things that you think make Simpson look better? User:Worldtraveller 19:52, 29 Jan 2005 (UTC) :No, it's consistent. My position has always been that there are some things that are too trivial or irrelevant for inclusion, and I think that level of detail about a trollish internet petition is excessive, at least for a biographical article on Ashlee Simpson. The fact of the petition is still recorded, but I placed it into better context. User:Everyking 20:11, 29 Jan 2005 (UTC) I think it's quite unfair to revert someone who's banned from reverting himself, Alkivar. It's not an even playing field. User:Everyking 01:48, 30 Jan 2005 (UTC) == SNL photo == I don't how long that SNL photo has said it was during a "rehearsal," but is there any proof of that? It seems unlikely to me. Why would she be so upset over a rehearsal? Would they have a boom microphone in a position like that for a rehearsal? Would they all be dressed the same way as they were during the show? What about the two guitar players - they look (to me) to be standing in the same positions they were during the actual performance, when they were on the main camera after she had walked away. User:Adam Bishop 01:55, 30 Jan 2005 (UTC) :She was wearing red during the actual performance, so logically it must be from the rehearsal. User:Everyking 01:57, 30 Jan 2005 (UTC) ::Hmm...you're right. Nuts. User:Adam Bishop 03:29, 30 Jan 2005 (UTC) ::Just for clarification: SNL dress rehearsals are produced as if they were the real show, so that the material can be substituted in rebroadcasts if the live show has problems. If the dress rehearsal performance had been completed, it probably would have been shown in the western US and in reruns instead of the mess seen live on the east coast. ::Before the show first aired, and SNL staffer did relate that the dress rehearsal went wrong. Marci was all set to get a substitute music act, but Joe insisted on doing the show, and the rest is... well. User:IMeowbot~User talk:IMeowbot 04:25, 31 Jan 2005 (UTC) Alkivar, the image should be right-aligned; that's standard and flows better with the text. Only left align in special cases. User:Everyking 04:19, 30 Jan 2005 (UTC) That is not notoriety! Reaction could be positive, in the form of sympathy, as easily as it could be negative. Please change it back, and cut out the redundant link again. User:Everyking 13:16, 1 Feb 2005 (UTC) :Why would I change it back? I made the edit because I think it improves the article. User:Worldtraveller 13:46, 1 Feb 2005 (UTC) ::Well yeah, but now you're supposed to see that you were wrong and change your mind about it. User:Everyking 16:59, 1 Feb 2005 (UTC) :Sorry, but I don't see that I was wrong. I don't see any evidence that the reaction to her lip-synching was anything other than overwhelmingly negative. User:Worldtraveller 17:24, 1 Feb 2005 (UTC) ::Then obviously you don't know what her fans think. Your version is highly POV and must be changed. User:Everyking 18:53, 1 Feb 2005 (UTC) == Merge of Ashlee Simpson on SNL == The result of the VfD on Ashlee Simpson on SNL was that it should be merged. The incident appears to me to already be thoroughly covered in the article, so I haven't added anything from [http://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=Ashlee_Simpson_on_SNL&oldid=9873316 Ashlee Simpson on SNL]. User:Dbenbenn | User talk:Dbenbenn 00:29, 2 Feb 2005 (UTC) :Yes. The idea behind having that article was to enable more detail to be written. Now we're stuck with what we've got. User:Everyking 00:49, 2 Feb 2005 (UTC) == "Backing tape" in the SNL incident== The references to a 'backing tape' in all of these articles need to be changed. Simpson's camp claims it was a backing tape she was going to sing along with; others claim it was a full-volume vocal track that she was going to lip-sync to (and that she was visibly miming during her first number). Calling it a 'backing tape' means supporting the former view (which seems to be the minority view among media commentators). User:68.118.61.219 05:18, 3 Feb 2005 (UTC) :Have it your way, then. You would know about neutrality better than me, after all: "Dpbsmith should put his findings on the Ashlee Simpson page in a paragraph on her declining reputation." User:Everyking 05:29, 3 Feb 2005 (UTC) ::That sounds fair, considering that is exactly what Dpbsmith's findings showed. -- User:Chuq 07:48, 3 Feb 2005 (UTC) :::This has all been analyzed to death. She did (try to) sing in the first song segment. There were two distinct copies of the lead vocal audible for the first several seconds, recorded and live. After that, the live vocal is cut off and it's only the recorded vocal (straight from the album). One of the channels had to go, because the two sounded bizarre, and the recording won. User:IMeowbot~User talk:IMeowbot 08:17, 3 Feb 2005 (UTC) I think including the petition figure is ridiculous. It's like me counting up all the posts on an Ashlee message board or something. The only point of having it is so people can point at it and say: Oh, look how many people don't like Ashlee! But it's deceptive, because it's probably a few hundred kids, maybe a few thousand. They don't deserve to have that kind of attention given to them—''maybe'' I'd accept it if others would accept some of the other things in the article that were removed for being "trivial", but which were in fact vastly more significant than that figure. It's a double standard, attaching more notability to anti-Ashlee information for no good reason. User:Everyking 08:40, 8 Feb 2005 (UTC) :I agree with Everyking's point about including the petition figure. IMO, not only are internet petitions pointless (and occasionally deceptive), but this is clearly POV (to me, anyway). I'd be willing to remove this paragraph not based on my knowledge of Ashlee Simpson, but simply based on my belief that internet petitions are pointless. --User:DeathphoenixUser_talk:Deathphoenix 14:51, 8 Feb 2005 (UTC) ---- On January 6, an Internet petition [http://www.petitiononline.com/StopAsh/petition.html] complaining about Simpson's singing was started. It accumulated nearly 300,000 signatures over the following weeks, making it among the most active of the site's petitions. [http://launch.yahoo.com/read/news/14285421] ---- :In fact, I decided to WP:BB and deleted the text above. I thought briefly about including the petition in the external links, but I don't think it's needed. Internet petitions are pointless anyways (or did I say that already?). --User:DeathphoenixUser_talk:Deathphoenix 15:10, 8 Feb 2005 (UTC) ::I decided to WP:BB and stuck it back in. I figure that any time people get worked up enough to collect 300,000 valid email addresses, it's worth mentioning. --User:Carnildo 19:02, 8 Feb 2005 (UTC) :::I respectfully disagree (but I won't WP:BB and remove it again (-:). It's very easy for people to bomb a petition with throwaway addresses. Being able to collect 300,000 valid email addresses could mean anything from 300,000 individual people actually signing the petition to one person signing 300,000 times under different identities. Of course, the answer is somewhere in between. But because of the wide variety of possible meanings, I don't see how including this piece of data is appropriate for an (online) encyclopedia. Strong reactions about Ashlee's singing? sure. But I don't see how an internet petition is a reliable source of information that can be used to demonstrate a point, because it can mean anything. --User:DeathphoenixUser_talk:Deathphoenix 20:36, 8 Feb 2005 (UTC) ::Seems to me it's worth mentioning, if it was one of the most popular on-line polls, but the number itself is not very important for the reasons Deathphoenix outlines. How about something like ''In January, an Internet petition at www.petitiononline.com [http://www.petitiononline.com/StopAsh/petition.html] complaining about Simpson's singing was among the most active of the site's petitions. [http://launch.yahoo.com/read/news/14285421]''? User:Worldtraveller 21:44, 8 Feb 2005 (UTC) :::I have no objection to either wording, but a link to the petition and the news article which mentions it should remain for verification purposes. I think having a number attached just requires us to keep updating it as the # of signatures increases. But simply based on the volume of signers (even if some of the entries are mickey mouse/donald duck/heywood jablome/etc...) Its much more likely that the real number of signers is going to outweigh the fakes, and as it did make the news its a noteworthy event. 23:20, 8 Feb 2005 (UTC) ::Yeah, I prefer User:Worldtraveller's version. "Most active of the site's petitions" is a good way to word it accurately. --User:DeathphoenixUser_talk:Deathphoenix 01:56, 9 Feb 2005 (UTC) :::Sounds good. --User:Carnildo 05:30, 9 Feb 2005 (UTC) ::::I changed the text to User:Worldtraveller's version. --User:DeathphoenixUser_talk:Deathphoenix 18:20, 3 Mar 2005 (UTC) ==Astroturfing== The "astroturfing" claim needs to be removed. There is apparently no evidence for it, and even if there was, it'd still be nonnotable. User:Everyking 06:56, 10 Feb 2005 (UTC) :Wrong. It is notable, and a few websites have linked to it and made a comment on it. - User:Ta bu shi da yu 06:58, 10 Feb 2005 (UTC) ::Wrong. A few websites linking to something does not make it notable. And I repeat that there appears to be no evidence. User:Everyking 07:05, 10 Feb 2005 (UTC) :::A few? You must be kidding. Try a google search of that phrase. Seems pretty damning to me! - User:Ta bu shi da yu 08:44, 10 Feb 2005 (UTC) :::The evidence seems pretty damning to me. Fifteen identical posts on message forums by the same username, said username only having the one post on each board? The same person making the exact same typo fifteen times? --User:Carnildo 07:17, 10 Feb 2005 (UTC) ::::Even Boing Boing has reported on it. 09:04, 10 Feb 2005 (UTC) This is weird. Maybe in my outrage I was not understood. Yes, there is ample evidence that posts were made. But where is the evidence that this was deliberate marketing my Simpson's people? In the first place, you need to attribute this claim, not state it as fact. User:Everyking 07:27, 11 Feb 2005 (UTC) :Want proof, here's proof... the posts in question were traced back to [http://www.guerillapr.com/ the firm responsible] by IP on several of the message boards, and up until the story broke on CNN (yes Guerilla advertising and this company in particular did hit CNN Headline News on Feb 7th) they proudly displayed that Geffen Records and Vivendi were customers. As of this moment in time they no longer show their connection. 08:22, 11 Feb 2005 (UTC) ::Could you provide a reference for this? --User:Carnildo 08:35, 11 Feb 2005 (UTC) :::For which part? 08:40, 11 Feb 2005 (UTC) ::::The IP trace. If there's an older version of the guerillapr.com page on the Internet Archive showing that Vivendi and Geffen were custormers, that would be nice as well. --User:Carnildo 08:43, 11 Feb 2005 (UTC) I liked Alkivar's edit summary. He should work to attribute the information in a NPOV manner instead of yelling at me. Blunt, unreferenced claims aren't acceptable. User:Everyking 08:53, 11 Feb 2005 (UTC) I hope TBSDY has a good explanation for that rollback. User:Everyking 12:28, 11 Feb 2005 (UTC) == Trying to make Ashlee Simpson look better is most definitely NOT npov == I object to this edit: [http://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=Ashlee_Simpson&diff=10160050&oldid=10160034]. It was changed from "Ashlee Simpson also later stated that she had acid reflux and her voice was apparently in such poor condition just hours before she was scheduled to perform—she may have had little choice but to rely heavily on the backing track." to "On the other hand, with her voice in such poor condition and given the importance of the show, she may have had little choice but to rely heavily on the backing track in that situation." I refuse to allow us to make Ashlee Simpson look better. That is not the point of an article: we state facts and we don't try to make people look better than they are. Hence I've rolled back and made an edit to fixup some text I was going to copyedit anyway. - User:Ta bu shi da yu 12:30, 11 Feb 2005 (UTC) :Rollback is designed to be used against vandalism, not in content disputes. User:Everyking 12:31, 11 Feb 2005 (UTC) ::Fine. It won't happen again. - User:Ta bu shi da yu 12:36, 11 Feb 2005 (UTC) I also object to you saying I'm trying to make her look better. My only goal is neutrality. I presume that's your goal, too, so we shouldn't have any need for dispute. User:Everyking 12:38, 11 Feb 2005 (UTC) :That was your edit? I didn't know that when I edited the article. I merely removed some weasel words (some people called her a hypocrite - who exactly?) and some text that appears to try to position Wikipedia into a justification of the whole incident. - User:Ta bu shi da yu 12:40, 11 Feb 2005 (UTC) An open question: should the "astroturfing" claims be in their own section, or rather in another, larger section, such as "controversies" or "in 2005"? User:Everyking 13:29, 11 Feb 2005 (UTC) :Personally, I agree with your edit of putting it into 2005. Works better with the flow. I wouldn't oppose you if you put it back the way it was. - User:Ta bu shi da yu 13:40, 11 Feb 2005 (UTC) One SNL video is more than enough. User:Everyking 21:58, 12 Feb 2005 (UTC) :I would also agree with this. - User:Ta bu shi da yu 10:00, 13 Feb 2005 (UTC) ::Its two different formats, I think its acceptable to have 2 links in this case. Its not a matter of being overly anti ashlee in this case. 10:10, 13 Feb 2005 (UTC) :::Oh. I wasn't aware of this. In that case, I agree with Alkivar. - User:Ta bu shi da yu 10:29, 13 Feb 2005 (UTC) Wikipedia is not a library for video clips. User:Everyking 11:57, 13 Feb 2005 (UTC) :When the videos are related to the topic, it is perfectly fine to have links to the clips. - User:Ta bu shi da yu 12:51, 13 Feb 2005 (UTC) ::This is advertising for lipsync.us. Tell you what. We can have the clips linked in the ext. links section, not in the text, but in exchange we get to remove the main lipsync.us link. User:Everyking 13:21, 13 Feb 2005 (UTC) :::If you have a problem with using lipsync.us, find the video in the alternative formats and post a link to them instead. The only steady easy to find versions I found were the ones on lipsync. 14:24, 13 Feb 2005 (UTC) ::::They will all be gone in a few months anyway. I try to think of Wikipedia over the long term. User:Everyking 14:26, 13 Feb 2005 (UTC) :::::So do I, whenever Jimbo gets off his butt and picks a definative video format for commons, I will get someone to reencode this (since LipSync.US has given permission) and upload it there. 14:54, 13 Feb 2005 (UTC) ::::::Well permission for their copy anyway, its still a fair use since SNL owns the actual copyright. 14:55, 13 Feb 2005 (UTC) :::::::I don't see how that would be fair use any more than all her other TV appearances would be fair use in video form. User:Everyking 16:55, 13 Feb 2005 (UTC) ::::::::It's fair use because it is "for purposes such as criticism, comment, news reporting, teaching (including multiple copies for classroom use), scholarship, or research", its presentation on Wikipedia is of a non-commercial, educational nature, the portion excerpted is small relative to the original work (i.e. the entire SNL broadcast that night), and there is no effect on the market value of the original work. (That episode of SNL is *not* available for purchase, to my knowledge.) User:Skyraider 17:35, 13 Feb 2005 (UTC) I suppose that applies to all her TV appearances, then? User:Everyking 17:56, 13 Feb 2005 (UTC) :It could. It really depends on how they're used. (Fair warning:IANAL.) User:Skyraider 19:27, 13 Feb 2005 (UTC) ::Yeah, I don't think that's right. User:Everyking 19:53, 13 Feb 2005 (UTC) :::Any copyrighted work *could* be used in a "fair use" manner in a subsequent work. Whether a specific use constitutes fair use is determined by the courts, but the law lays out explicitly what factors are to be considered in making that determination. The nature of the original and subsequent works and the manner of use are key factors. (Fair use is an excellent article, IMO.) User:Skyraider 20:46, 13 Feb 2005 (UTC) ==POV pushing== Everyking's recent edit summary: ''summarize a little...we deleted the article on the tour and this is not 1% as notable as that''. Everyking, you only ever want to 'summarise' or 'trim' things that are not favourable to Simpson. It's really irritating to see such flagrant pushing of a POV. The VfD on the tour article does not entitle you to some kind of quid pro quo removal of information which casts her in a bad light. Pop groups tour all the time - underhand publicity techniques are somewhat less common, so what makes you think a tour is 100 times as notable? User:Worldtraveller 23:17, 2 Mar 2005 (UTC) :Oh, is this about the BBS spamming thing? It's extremely common nowadays, used for virtually all new major label acts. That's part of the so-called viral marketing that companies like Fanscape, Fanpimp etc. perform in addition to the more visible "street team" stuff. --User:IMeowbot~User talk:IMeowbot 00:58, 3 Mar 2005 (UTC) ::It's also usually a violation of "terms of use" agreements on the forums where it occurs. User:24.195.17.40 17:32, 9 Mar 2005 (UTC) ::: Okay, then an article about the marketing practice might be useful, or perhaps a discussion of it under one of the existing spam articles. To dig up the relevant postings bring it up in the article for each and every current music act would be serious overkill, bordering on spam itself, though. --User:IMeowbot~User talk:IMeowbot 23:23, 9 Mar 2005 (UTC) ==Photo Queue== I'm sure there are plenty of good photographs for the article. However I removed this one for the moment since 1) we already have a photo from her tv show 2) this sorta clutters up the section around the discography since there is already another photo there. I personally recommend not readding this one, but thats up to a consensus. 06:57, 11 Mar 2005 (UTC) :It could do with a better caption if it is re-inserted. User:TheCustomOfLife 07:00, Mar 11, 2005 (UTC) Presumably the section will grow and then it can be readded? User:Everyking 07:03, 11 Mar 2005 (UTC) :I have no objection to another photo in that section once its expanded, however I personally would prefer a different image not a 2nd image from her TV show (just for varieties sake). 07:06, 11 Mar 2005 (UTC) ::Well, I think screenshots are considered free from copyright issues, whereas most everything else isn't. User:Everyking 07:22, 11 Mar 2005 (UTC) :::No screenshots are not "free from copyright issues", however they are "fair use", the problem of course becomes that Jimbo eventually plans on removing "fair use" images, and that "fair use" images arent commercially useable which goes against the whole GFDL'd encyclopedia concept. 07:26, 11 Mar 2005 (UTC) ::::I don't know about all those legal matters, but the point stands that screenshots can apparently be used before most other things can. User:Everyking 07:30, 11 Mar 2005 (UTC) =="Trivia"== Is this: :As a guest on a European television show she participated in a "Keepin' it Real" segment where she was tested on common knowledge. She was unable to state the cost of a carton of milk, nor could she name the capital of Spain or what the employment position of Condoleeza Rice was. This was featured in episode eight of season two of The Ashlee Simpson Show. ...notable enough for inclusion? I think it could be worth a mention in the article on the reality show, but not here. If you agree, feel free to remove it, because I'm not allowed to. User:Everyking 12:13, 18 Mar 2005 (UTC) ::Trivia sections in general are frowned upon, we're supposed to find a way to work it into the article itself. Perhaps this would be decent comparison material versus her "intelligent" chicken of the sea sister? 15:38, 18 Mar 2005 (UTC) :::No, I don't really see how it has any place in the article at all. User:Everyking 16:27, 18 Mar 2005 (UTC) ::::Thats because you never see a reason to include any negative information. 16:58, 18 Mar 2005 (UTC) :::::It was on the show; if it was so negative, I don't suppose they would've shown it on the show. My only point is that it's too trivial for this article, but might have a place on the TASS article. User:Everyking 17:27, 18 Mar 2005 (UTC) ::::::Since I was the person who added it, I guess I'll defend it. Considering that she has accomplished relatively little in terms of famous entertainers, I'd be hard pressed to understand how this information is any more or less trivial than any of the other minutea mentioned within the article. Ashlee simpson, by and large, is hardly a person of great accomplishment. That being said, I think the information is important in establishing exactly what kind of a person Ashlee Simpson is; IE, one who is relatively removed from "real life," and not very educated. There is no reason why a person who is successful enough to be in the public eye should not have achieved enough of a level of education or personal knowledge to know who Condoleeza Rice is. It speaks volumes about who Ashlee Simpson is as a person. I fully support removal of a "trivia" section, but I don't think it would be appropriate to remove the information completely. User:Pacian 06:44, 19 Mar 2005 (UTC) I tell you, if I tried to add some comparable level of trivia, it'd be removed within an hour. But I wouldn't even ''want'' to. User:Everyking 13:30, 19 Mar 2005 (UTC) Any idea what [http://www.livejournal.com/community/ashleesimpson/243587.html these people] are talking about, about some picture that's disgusting? They seem to be saying the article was vandalized with an image, but in the history I see no vandalism at the time when they would have been looking at the page...I see no image vandalism at any time, anyway. User:Everyking 14:45, 21 Mar 2005 (UTC) :Image poison vandalism... the album cover was changed to Goatse guy. It's been reverted. 15:00, 21 Mar 2005 (UTC) ::I should be more specific, someone renamed it to the same as the album cover and uploaded it in its place, they did not alter the article itself. 15:01, 21 Mar 2005 (UTC) :::Ah, I always lack imagination when I try to figure out vandals. User:Everyking 17:28, 21 Mar 2005 (UTC) It's generally difficult to find out a place of birth definitively, short of a statement by the person him/herself. Jessica's place of birth was given wrongly for years; it's even stated wrongly on her own website. For that reason I've never added a place of birth to this article, no matter if there's a statement from the label on the website or not. My personal preference would be not to include it without something more conclusive. Coming at the very beginning of the article makes it very important to get it right. User:Everyking 16:46, 28 Mar 2005 (UTC) : Given that the Simpson press kits and releases have all been consistent about this detail, it can stand, unless ''all'' information that has been released through Geffen is to be retracted as suspect. --User:IMeowbot~User talk:IMeowbot 16:56, 28 Mar 2005 (UTC) ::I would rather wait to hear her mention her birthplace, or one of her family, since I'm a stickler for accuracy above all else. But if you disagree, of course I am powerless to do anything about it, so I guess that's that. User:Everyking 17:03, 28 Mar 2005 (UTC) :::It looks like her birthplace was either Dallas or Waco. Given the history of Waco, my guess is she would say Dallas regardless. I guess it doesn't really matter either way. You could say "in or near Dallas" if it matters that much. -- 17:38, 28 Mar 2005 (UTC) ::::Given that the only hospital I can find in Waco (via google search) is a Veterans Affairs hospital, unless she was born via Midwife at home, she was likely born in one of the 14 hospitals in the Dallas Metro area (a mere hours drive away.) ALKIVAR">User:Alkivar™ 18:55, 28 Mar 2005 (UTC) :::::I made the change to from Waco to Dallas. Her [http://www.imdb.com/name/nm1249883/ IMDB profile] indicates that to be her birthplace, and sites like [http://dallas.about.com/od/localcelebrityprofiles/p/ashleesimpson.htm this] and [http://www.biogs.com/famous/simpsonashlee.html this] agree. I've seen some that state her birthplace as Waco, but from what I can see, a lot of them are actually Wikipedia mirrors. --User:DeathphoenixUser_talk:Deathphoenix 05:58, 9 Apr 2005 (UTC) ==Dead links== Two of the external links, for the fan site and the associated pictures site, have gone dead, and at present it's unclear if they will ever be back, so I figure we should remove them for the time being (I'm sure User:IMeowbot knows why they are down, but I don't). At the same time, however, if we don't have a fan site to link to, we shouldn't link to lipsync.us either, so we should remove that link for balance. User:Everyking 10:05, 5 Apr 2005 (UTC) :Just stick in a link to a different fan site. There's tons of those things. Somebody revert the anon edit, please. User:Everyking 06:42, 9 Apr 2005 (UTC) :Done. ALKIVAR">User:Alkivar™ 06:50, 9 Apr 2005 (UTC) Either Pacian's recent paragraph should be cited and demonstrated to be in some way notable, or it should be removed. User:Everyking 05:43, 10 Apr 2005 (UTC) : I don't like you very much, Everyking, and I have to be honest, I don't think you're a very good Wikipedian. I'd like to inform you, in case you didn't already know, that the users of this website are in fact human persons. I understand that you feel the need to be blunt and use candor about your opinion, but does it actually cause you some kind of physical pain to be polite to others? You seem to have a wicked habit of stating your opinion without actually stating it, and then making it sound like it's the ONLY correct opinion (all the while ignoring the potential effect it may have on others and their feelings.) For instance, above, you are basically saying "Pacian's recent paragraph is not notable, and it should be removed." Well, I happen to disagree, and you don't get to definitively decide what is notable and what is not, sir. It is NOTABLE because for a celebrity to potentially offer an indirect endoresment of a product that is in direct competition with a product they are paid to represent could result in millions of dollars of legal damages, and though it is a developing incident, it is none the less completely legit. As a citation, why not visiting The Smoking Gun (the very website I - GASP - cited!) In all seriousness, you need to start thinking about people's feelings. You don't have to kiss butt, but you could TRY to phrase things more politely and considerately. User:Pacian 06:02, 10 Apr 2005 (UTC) ::I'm sorry that you don't like me. I have no particular opinion about you. I am aware of the Smoking Gun link. However, where is the cite for this claim that chewing some other kind of gum could produce some big controversy? Personal speculation isn't notable. If you ask me, if she's just quietly chewing the gum in her dressing room, that wouldn't rationally seem to contradict any contracts, anyway. I don't know who made those papers public, but it certainly wasn't her or her management. So this stuff should be cited. And before it even needs to be included at all, there should be a demonstration of notability. The Smoking Gun thing is arguably very, very marginally notable. But speculation about one particular aspect of it? I think there should be a demonstration of notability for that. User:Everyking 06:10, 10 Apr 2005 (UTC) :::Drudge reported there is a lawsuit pending. Its relevant. ALKIVAR">User:Alkivar™ 06:19, 10 Apr 2005 (UTC) ::::If you can give a cite, then the paragraph (appropriately modified) can go back in. --User:Carnildo 06:22, 10 Apr 2005 (UTC) ::::If there really is a lawsuit pending, OK, that'd make it notable. But where's a cite to show that a lawsuit is indeed pending? User:Everyking 06:23, 10 Apr 2005 (UTC) :::::The specific page of the smoking gun site in question about the gum is [http://www.thesmokinggun.com/archive/0408051_ashlee_simpson_9.html page 9]. The question I have, is should the paragraph mention the fact that the documents state the drummer is responsible for "pre-recorded sequences" even tho she swears she doesnt use them? Thats on [http://www.thesmokinggun.com/archive/0408051_ashlee_simpson_2.html page 2]. I happen to find that more controversial. I cant seem to find the link on drudge that was on there earlier today. ALKIVAR">User:Alkivar™ 06:35, 10 Apr 2005 (UTC) ::::::That wording was a little odd. It says that the "orchestration" includes pre-recorded sequences. Does this "orchestration" include Ashlee? Pre-recorded sequences could be background sound effects, like what someone would normally play on a synthesizer. --brian0918">User:Brian0918™">User talk:Brian0918 06:37, 10 Apr 2005 (UTC) ::::::::I would assume it's various intrumentation they can't properly duplicate with the band. I think that's common. User:Everyking 06:40, 10 Apr 2005 (UTC) :I've removed the paragraph. The "Smoking Gun" link is just a set of scans (or maybe transcriptions) of Ashlee's requirements for performing; any claims of controversy based on that would be original research. --User:Carnildo 06:22, 10 Apr 2005 (UTC) Alkivar's edit directly claims that the prerecorded sequences are vocal. This is highly unlikely to be true and there is no evidence to support it. User:Everyking 06:43, 10 Apr 2005 (UTC) :I'm sorry if thats the way you took it, feel free to specify a better wording. I did not mean to imply it was necessarily vocal oriented. I think they happened to pick deliberately overbroad wording with "pre-recorded sequences" so as to potentially include vocals. ALKIVAR">User:Alkivar™ 06:45, 10 Apr 2005 (UTC) ::Your edit claims she contradicted herself. That's not true. She only said she wasn't using any vocal guide tracks. That's not the same thing at all. User:Everyking 06:49, 10 Apr 2005 (UTC) :::I have since tried to clarify my statement, is this better? ALKIVAR">User:Alkivar™ 06:50, 10 Apr 2005 (UTC) ::::It still falsely accuses her of contradicting herself, drawing a false connection between what she said about guide vocals and the possible use of recorded instrumentation sequences. She did not deny the use of the latter. User:Everyking 06:55, 10 Apr 2005 (UTC) :::::Suggest a specific wording then. I'll be happy to change it, I just think it should be included. ALKIVAR">User:Alkivar™ 07:01, 10 Apr 2005 (UTC) ::::::Just remove the quote, and don't suggest there's a contradiction. User:Everyking 07:02, 10 Apr 2005 (UTC) :::::::You should probably not be posting here, it looks like it violates your arbcom ruling. The only way I could see you getting around it is to talk on user pages, and not use her name specifically, but I wouldn't suggest trying to get around arbcom rulings, they might not like that. --brian0918">User:Brian0918™">User talk:Brian0918 07:04, 10 Apr 2005 (UTC) ::::::::What on earth would make you think the ruling applies to talk pages? Rulings hardly ever apply to talk pages. User:Everyking 07:05, 10 Apr 2005 (UTC) :::::::::Nevermind. --brian0918">User:Brian0918™">User talk:Brian0918 07:10, 10 Apr 2005 (UTC) ::::::::That's silly. It specifically says "article". User:Silsor 07:07, Apr 10, 2005 (UTC) :::::::::It seems to me what it says quite plainly is that he is not allowed to edit articles and that, in fact, the only participation allowed is if he sees vandalism in progress (and if so he is expected to report that to someone else so that they can make the correction.) In other words, coming to a talk page to state that something within the article doesn't belong is *NOT* tantamount to reporting vandalism to an appropriate party. Using a talk page to attempt to get changes made that you would make on your own, if you could, is just an attempt at bypassing the fact that you have been instructed not to make changes. User:Pacian 07:17, 10 Apr 2005 (UTC) :::::::::::What it says quite plainly is that I cannot edit articles. Which means I can edit talk pages to my heart's content. User:Everyking 07:24, 10 Apr 2005 (UTC) ::::::::::::You could try contributing something meaningful to the encyclopedia. --brian0918">User:Brian0918™">User talk:Brian0918 07:27, 10 Apr 2005 (UTC) :::::::::::::I make at least 100-150 edits on an average day, and I have a featured article to my credit, so I must be doing something meaningful. User:Everyking 07:30, 10 Apr 2005 (UTC) ::::::::::::::See my comment above. --brian0918">User:Brian0918™">User talk:Brian0918 07:35, 10 Apr 2005 (UTC) :::::::::::::::Maybe you don't think my work's been meaningful, but I can just about guarantee you that I've done a lot more than you have. User:Everyking 07:37, 10 Apr 2005 (UTC) ::::::::::::::::My suggestion was for your future work over the next year. It'd be more meaningful to write new articles than to fix spelling errors and bicker 24/7 on Ashlee Simpson talk pages. You may have more edits, but I guarantee that my edits are more meaningful to the encyclopedia. :) brian0918">User:Brian0918™">User talk:Brian0918 07:41, 10 Apr 2005 (UTC) :::::::::::::::::And I have written new articles recently, for instance: Central African Republic elections, 2005, Togo presidential election, 2005, Liberia elections, 2005 (maybe others I'm forgetting), not to mention expanding lots of other articles. But why am I justifying any of my work to you? User:Everyking 07:47, 10 Apr 2005 (UTC) ::::::::::::::::::Not sure. --brian0918">User:Brian0918™">User talk:Brian0918 07:50, 10 Apr 2005 (UTC) ::::::::::::::Just curious, Everyking--since Wikipedia articles are a community effort and nobody owns them, how do you have a featured article to "your" credit? User:24.195.27.248 00:46, 14 Apr 2005 (UTC) :::::::::::::::Because I wrote it. What does that have to do with owning it? User:Everyking 08:20, 14 Apr 2005 (UTC) ==Removed speculation== :''On April 09, 2005, The Smoking Gun posted one of Simpson's concert riders. In it she demands that either Dentyne or Orbit (gum) gum be provided at her venue. This has caused a conflict with her paid commercial endorsement of Liquid Ice mints and gum, part of the Ice Breakers mint and gum line. Ice Breakers are a product of Hershey corporation, while Dentyne is made by Cadbury and Orbit is made by Wrigley. Aligning herself in any fashion with mint or gum products made by the competitors of the company for whom she is a paid commercial endorser is cause for major legal action, though whether anything will come of it remains to be seen. Also of note in this report is a mention of "pre-recorded sequences" which could potentially include vocals, something Simpson claims to have stopped using as recently as April 8 in a Sun-Sentinel.com interview by Jon Bream regarding her Florida tour leg: "'There will be no backing vocal tracks at all,' Ashlee Simpson said of her current tour". [http://www.sun-sentinel.com/features/lifestyle/sfl-liashleeapr09,0,5159381.story]'' Without a cite for a lawsuit or threat thereof, this paragraph feels like original research. If you wish to re-insert it, please provide a citation. And please stop editing this page so fast -- I can't get a word in endwise! --User:Carnildo 07:45, 10 Apr 2005 (UTC) :I'm fine with it. Alkivar now says he may have been wrong about the lawsuit. --brian0918">User:Brian0918™">User talk:Brian0918 07:48, 10 Apr 2005 (UTC) Someone edit the anon addition--her career does not need "saving", least of all by an internet petition, which are not taken seriously by anyone whether they are for or against her. User:Everyking 17:50, 10 Jun 2005 (UTC) :Done. I've removed the sentence and link to the "Save Ashlee" petition. --User:DeathphoenixUser_talk:Deathphoenix 19:51, 10 Jun 2005 (UTC) == Why does this article exist at all? == Guys, Given the level of acrimony I'm seeing here between her supporters and critics, I have to ask whether you don't all have something better to do? Ten years from now, she'll be forgotten just like the Bay City Rollers, Menudo, and the New Kids on the Block. Leave this subject for the tabloids. :What? You don't want an article on Menudo? User:Everyking 04:37, 18 Apr 2005 (UTC) ::I think as long as it's a topic is fairly notable, someone some where in the world would find its entry helpful. When articles start popping up about the World's biggest cheeto, that's where we might want to start drawing the line. :::You're kidding me. We don't have an article on the world's biggest cheeto yet? User:Everyking 04:54, 18 Apr 2005 (UTC) ::::If you're going to have articles on the likes of Ashlee Simpson and Menudo, then there should probably be a category for pseudo-musicians; products of marketing departments, lip-sync coaches, choreographers, plastic surgeons, and publicity agents. Whatever these people are, they're NOT musicians. :::::There's an article on Milli Vanilli, if that's what you're looking for. --User:Carnildo 22:19, 18 Apr 2005 (UTC) :::::Yeah, because we decide whether or not people should have articles based on whether they suit your personal taste. User:Everyking 22:23, 18 Apr 2005 (UTC) :::::: It's not a matter of taste, it's a matter of significance. I have no use for Jackson Pollock at all, but he is significant for founding the P.T. Barnum mode of selling so-called artwork. This little ditz will be throughly forgotten in another year, tops. :::::::That's possible. But irrelevant. She's very famous. User:Everyking 17:45, 20 Apr 2005 (UTC) ::::::::And how much more famous has she become because of you, sir? --User:Newnoise 20:48, 22 Apr 2005 (UTC) :::::::::I can't imagine an increased familiarity among a few Wikipedia editors compares to millions of albums sold, millions of TV viewers, and dozens of sold out concerts. But if you want to credit me with that kind of influence in the world, hey, I don't mind. User:Everyking 20:52, 22 Apr 2005 (UTC) There's a paragraph about the Punk'd episode I wrote on the Wikicity project. Someone could add that here, perhaps with less detail. User:Everyking 21:19, 25 Apr 2005 (UTC) Someone please improve the Punk'd paragraph that an anon added. My suggestion is something along these lines, possibly in abbreviated form: :On April 24, 2005, she appeared in an episode of the MTV celebrity prank show Punk'd. She was the subject of a prank in which she was set up to think that her jacket had caught on fire due to being placed near a candle, causing the overhead sprinklers in the art museum she was in to go off, thus ruining the paintings in the room. She became upset when confronted about it, but then laughed and was playfully angry when the prank was revealed to her by the show's host, Ashton Kutcher. User:Everyking 22:21, 29 Apr 2005 (UTC) Somebody please revert the anon. It is vandalism but maybe not quite blatant enough for me to be able to get away with reverting it. User:Everyking 23:12, 16 May 2005 (UTC) :Definitely vandalism, but I think you did the right thing by not reverting it yourself. User:Rhobite 23:16, May 16, 2005 (UTC) I don't understand the anon's edit. More tears? Where's the first mention of tears? User:Everyking 22:41, 6 Jun 2005 (UTC) :Agreed. Plus the awkwardness of "reduced into" vs. "reduced to" and the passive voice of "Ashlee Simpson was reduced. . ." Cleaned it up to what I hope is a generally acceptable version. User:Skyraider 16:55, 9 Jun 2005 (UTC) ::Yeah, that contributor is sort of odd. All of his contributions seem to be about celebrities who appeared on Punk'd. Most of his sentences are awkward, maybe he's a kid. I agree that "reduced into tears" is a strange way of putting it. Don't know why he keeps reverting to his version of the sentence. User:Rhobite 20:03, Jun 10, 2005 (UTC) ==Ext links== In my opinion the ext. links section is a bit bloated and could use some trimming. Any thoughts on what (if anything) we could remove? User:Everyking 03:29, 23 Jun 2005 (UTC) :A subject near and dear to my heart. Is there a directory of fan sites that could replace the separate fan site links? Also, I don't think we need the SNL incident in three formats. Unless the MPEG one is of significantly lower quality, I think having just that one will suffice (MPEG is the nearest to a "free" format of the three, and also has the widest compatibility). --User:Weyes(User talk:Weyes) 03:33, 2005 Jun 23 (UTC)
#REDIRECT Ashlee Simpson
See other meanings of words starting from letter:
Words begining with Ashlee_Simpson:
Ashlee_Simpson
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Ashlee Simpson
[[Image:A-simpson-shadow-sitting.jpg|frame|right|Ashlee Simpson in her "Shadow (song)" music video (2004)]] Ashlee Nicole Simpson (born October 3, 1984 in Dallas, Texas) is an United States singer, actress and the younger sister of singer Jessica Simpson. She rose to prominence in mid-2004, when her first album, the now RIAA certification ''Autobiography (Ashlee Simpson album)'', Debut album at number one in sales, accompanied by a successful reality television, ''The Ashlee Simpson Show''. In October 2004, she was caught lip sync to a pre-recorded studio track on the sketch comedy show ''Saturday Night Live''; this highly publicized incident drew substantial negative attention from the Journalism. ==Early career== Simpson, the daughter of Joe Simpson (manager) and Tina Simpson, was born and raised in Texas, where she was homeschooling by her mother. While her sister Jessica Simpson, four years older, displayed an early talent for singing, Ashlee danced from the age of three and was admitted to the School of American Ballet in New York City at age 11.Ashlee Simpson#Notes and references After her sister Jessica signed a record deal, the family moved to Los Angeles, California, where Ashlee began auditioning for television commercials—her first commercial was for the department store Kohl's.Ashlee Simpson#Notes and references Jessica achieved success in pop music in 1999 with her song "I Wanna Love You Forever" and the album ''Sweet Kisses'', and Ashlee became a backup dancer in Jessica's concerts. She also appeared in an episode of the television situation comedy ''Malcolm in the Middle'' and had a minor role in the 2002 movie ''The Hot Chick'', a comedy starring Rob Schneider. Simpson played the character Cecilia on the television show ''7th Heaven'' from 2002 until the beginning of her singing career in 2004, at which point she stopped regular appearances. ==Music and film== In 2003, Simpson recorded a song, "Just Let Me Cry," for the soundtrack to the movie ''Freaky Friday'', and also signed a record deal with Geffen Records. She recorded an album, ''Autobiography'', released in the U.S. on July 20, 2004. It debuted at number one on the Billboard 200 chart and was certified triple RIAA certification in September 2004. The single (music) "Pieces of Me" preceded the album, was one of the most widely-played songs in the U.S. in mid-2004, and sold well internationally. The next single, "Shadow (song)", was less successful and not released in the U.K. The U.K.-sourced "La La (song)" single followed in 2005. Simpson and her music career were the subject of ''The Ashlee Simpson Show'', a successful reality show on MTV. She had previously appeared on ''Newlyweds'', an already successful reality show about the married life of Jessica and her husband Nick Lachey, and ''The Ashlee Simpson Show'' aired in the subsequent time slot. The show ran in the U.S. for eight weekly episodes from June 16 until August 4, 2004, and dealt with the process of writing, recording, and performing, and with aspects of Simpson's personal life. The first episode of the second season aired in the U.S. on January 26, 2005. Simpson performs live with a backing band, which consists of Ray Brady (guitar), Braxton Olita (guitar), Zach Kennedy (bass guitar), Lucy Walsh (keyboards and vocals) and Chris Fox (drums). On September 29, 2004, she announced on her website that the band would be named "Ashlee Simpson and Submission," taking the name from the fact that they had received so many submissions of proposals for the name. Her manager is her father, Joe Simpson. At the August 8, 2004 Teen Choice Awards show, Simpson received the "Song of the Summer" award for "Pieces of Me," as well as the "Fresh Face" award. She performed "Pieces of Me" during the pre-show for the 2004 MTV Video Music Awards on August 29, and during the actual show she presented an award with Tony Hawk for "Best New Artist in a Video." In December of the same year, she won a Billboard Award for New Female Artist of the Year. Ashlee and her sister Jessica recorded a duet (music) of the Christmas song "Little Drummer Boy" together for ''Rejoyce: The Christmas Album'', a 2004 Christmas album by Jessica; they sang the song together during "Nick & Jessica's Family Christmas", a variety show special which aired on American Broadcasting Company on December 1. [http://abc.go.com/specials/nickjess_xmas.html] Ashlee also sang "Christmas Past, Present, and Future" on the 2004 holiday album ''Radio Disney Jingle Jams''. Simpson has a role in the upcoming movie ''Undiscovered'' (originally titled ''Wannabe''), which began filming in November. She cut her hair shorter for her role as Clea, an aspiring actress and "tomboy". The Lions Gate Films property is directed by Meiert Avis and is described as a "romantic comedy film". [http://www.mtv.com/movies/news/articles/1493864/11182004/story.jhtml] She was shown talking about the film on its set in a segment on ''Total Request Live'' on November 30. ==Style and personal life== Ashlee has a somewhat more rebellious and rock-oriented image than that of her sister. Previously blonde like Jessica, she dyed her hair dark during the recording of the reality show (in the fifth episode), after she had finished filming for ''7th Heaven''. Ashlee's songs also have rock elements absent from her sister's music. Her vocals, while generally not thought to equal her sister's range, have been praised by some as fitting the style of her music, and are sometimes described (positively or negatively) as raspy. Simpson often wears shirts with "punk"-style designs and typically has her fingernails painted black. She has refused to discuss her sex life, in contrast to Jessica, who openly stated her intention to remain a virginity until marriage. "I decided that I didn't want to talk about that because it's super personal," she has said.Ashlee Simpson#Notes and references Ashlee got a tattoo of a star on her left wrist after the release of her album, and another tattoo of two cherries was seen on her ankle in 2005. [http://www.mtv.com/bands/s/simpson_ashlee/news_feature_050328/] Simpson's relationship with Josh Henderson, who had previously appeared on ''Popstars'', lasted about two years and ended during the first episode of ''The Ashlee Simpson Show''. Soon she began her relationship with Ryan Cabrera, a musician who also released his debut album in 2004; this relationship also featured in the reality show (particularly in episodes three and four of the first season), and Simpson appeared in the music video for Cabrera's song "On the Way Down" as Cabrera's love interest. The two were reported to have split up in August 2004 due to their busy schedules, but they were still sometimes seen together in the months that followed, and in the first episode of the second season of ''The Ashlee Simpson Show'', Simpson indicated that they had resumed their relationship. In October 2004, they did a series of concerts at high schools together, and this was shown in the second episode of the reality show's second season. Simpson and her sister Jessica were tied for third on Mr. Blackwell's list of the worst-dressed celebrities of 2004. Blackwell wrote that "from gaudy to grim to downright frenetic these two prove that bad taste is positively genetic." In early May 2005, Ashlee cut her hair short and dyed it a shade of light brown with blonde highlights. On June 19, she appeared at the MuchMusic Video Awards, where she performed "La La", with fully blonde (and longer) hair. ==''Saturday Night Live'' incident== Simpson appeared on ''Saturday Night Live'' as a musical guest on October 24, 2004. As is customary for musical guests, she was scheduled to give two performances, the first of "Pieces of Me" and the second of "Autobiography." As she was beginning the second performance, however, a recording of "Pieces of Me" - including vocals - started playing before she had raised the microphone to her mouth. Simpson, uncertain of how to react, danced nervously (as she later called it, a "hoe-down") and then left the stage. After an emergency television commercial, she appeared again during the show's closing with the guest host of the night, Jude Law, and apologized, saying that her band had started playing the wrong song. Others, however, criticized her for what they saw as evidence that she was lip synching. On Monday, October 25, Simpson called in to ''Total Request Live'', a widely-viewed U.S. top ten music video show, and explained that she had been having trouble with her vocal cords due to acid reflux and could not sing well, and thus had no choice but to perform with a guide track. For the second performance, Simpson said that her drummer had hit the wrong button and consequently the wrong track played. Prior to the incident, Simpson expressed her distaste with lip synching in an interview with ''Lucky (magazine)'' magazine: "I'm totally against it and offended by it. I'm going out to let my real talent show, not to just stand there and dance around. Personally, I'd never lip-synch. It's just not me." During the October 25, 2004 Radio Music Awards broadcast, Simpson made fun of the ''SNL'' mistake by pretending at first to be caught in the same mistake with "Pieces of Me" as before, before saying "Just kidding, you guys!" and going into a performance of "Autobiography." On the morning of October 26, she discussed the incident with Katie Couric on ''The Today Show'', and on October 31, the CBS news program ''60 Minutes'' aired footage from Simpson's rehearsals before the ''SNL'' performance, in which she was shown having trouble with her voice and being visibly upset. ==In 2005== Simpson began her first U.S. headlining tour on February 16, 2005, in Anaheim, California, [http://www.mtv.com/news/articles/1497210/20050217/simpson_ashlee.jhtml?headlines=true] and it ended in Grand Prairie, Texas on April 20. During the tour, she performed three cover songs in addition to her usual ''Autobiography'' songs: The Pretenders' "Brass in Pocket", Blondie (band)'s "Call Me", and Madonna (entertainer)'s "Burning Up". Her opening acts were Pepper's Ghost (band) and The Click Five; she performed a generally consistent setlist, beginning with "Autobiography" and ending with "La La", then returning to the stage to sing "Pieces of Me" in a white dress as an encore. She also included the unreleased song "Hollywood" in her setlists. In a ''TRL'' appearance on February 7, in which she talked about the tour prior to its start, she said that she planned to work on her next album with her band while touring, and that the next album might be released around Fall 2005. Elsewhere, she said that the tour would be "stripped down", without pyrotechnics, and that "it's going to be me and my band getting out there and having fun." [http://www.cincypost.com/2005/03/08/ashlee030805.html] Simpson was on the cover of the February 2005 issue of ''Cosmopolitan (magazine)'' magazine, [http://www.ashleemedia.net/displayimage.php?album=435&pos=0] and she was chosen as its "Fun Fearless Female of the Year". [http://www.ashleemedia.net/displayimage.php?album=435&pos=2] In March 2005, Simpson stated that she would like to incorporate the feel of 1980s music on her second album, and that it would focus less on relationships and more on herself. She also said that she wanted to do another television show, but that ''The Ashlee Simpson Show'' would conclude at the end of its second season, [http://www.mtv.com/news/articles/1499052/20050325/simpson_ashlee.jhtml?headlines=true] the tenth and last episode of which aired on March 30. On the April 24, 2005 episode of ''Punk'd'', Ashton Kutcher and his crew members set up a fake art museum and arranged for Simpson to visit it. They then convinced Simpson that her friend's jacket had caught fire due to being placed near a candle, causing the overhead sprinklers to go off, and ruining all the paintings in the room. In June 2005, Simpson claims she denied accusations that she, Jessica Simpson, and actress Lindsay Lohan got into a catfight at the post-party of the 2005 MTV Movie Awards and said that Lohan claimed that Simpson stole her ex-boyfriend, ''That 70s Show star Wilmer Valderrama. ==Controversial incidents== On January 4, 2005, Simpson performed "La La" at the halftime show for the Orange Bowl in Miami, Florida. When her performance was finished, many of the 72,000-plus spectators booed.[http://www.local10.com/entertainment/4048912/detail.html][http://www.mtv.com/news/articles/1495731/20050111/index.jhtml?headlines=true] Various explanations for the booing have been suggested: that it may have been a belated reaction to the ''SNL'' incident or a distaste for Simpson's singing (some claimed that her voice during the performance was poor and off-key). Or, it may have simply been dissatisfaction with the half-time show as a whole, which has been viewed in recent years as "too MTV" (a negative for the target audience). In January, an Internet petition at petitiononline.com [http://www.petitiononline.com/StopAsh/petition.html] complaining about Simpson's singing was among the most active of the site's petitions. [http://launch.yahoo.com/read/news/14285421] Simpson later said about the petition that "an 18-year-old girl started it, and that's cool. You don't always have to be a fan of everybody's music." She also mentioned the support she has received from her "amazing fans". [http://www.sunherald.com/mld/thesunherald/entertainment/11036610.htm] Also in early 2005, Simpson's marketing campaign was accused of astroturfing on various websites. A post on Metafilter claims that the marketing company posted the same text under the user name "mandyc19" on over three hundred different music-related forums. [http://www.metafilter.com/mefi/38963] ==Trivia== * As a guest on a European television show she participated in a "Keepin' it Real" segment where she was tested on common knowledge. She was unable to state the cost of a carton of milk, nor could she name the capital of Spain or what the employment position of Condoleezza Rice was. This was featured in episode eight of season two of ''The Ashlee Simpson Show''. ==Discography== *"Pieces of Me", single (music), June 29 2004 in music *''Autobiography (Ashlee Simpson album)'', album, July 20 2004 in music *"Shadow (song)", single, November 8 2004 in music (Australia), December 20 2004 in music (Europe) *"La La (song)", single, January 24 2005 in music ==Notes and references== # Although the minimum age for admission was technically 12, Joe Simpson said that he lied about his daughter's age to get her into the school in an October 2004 interview. (Leeds, Jeff. ''The New York Times'', [http://query.nytimes.com/gst/abstract.html?res=F60C12FA3F5C0C708CDDA90994DC404482&incamp=archive:search "Who Wants to Be a New Simpson?",] October 3, 2004.) # Brown, Janelle. ''Seventeen'', [http://www.ashleemedia.net/displayimage.php?album=334&pos=4 "Ashlee Simpson".] November 2004, pages 86–89. # Adams, Patty. ''YM'', [http://www.ashleemedia.net/displayimage.php?album=207&pos=3 "The Sister Who Rocks".] September 2004, pages 112–117. ==Vocal Profile== *Voice type: Spinto Contralto *Highest note: E5 *Lowest note: E3 *Vocal range: 2 octaves ==External links== * [http://www.ashleesimpsonmusic.com Official site] * * [http://www.nndb.com/people/886/000052730/ Ashlee Simpson] at Notable Names Database ; Fan sites * [http://www.ashlee.us ashlee.us] * [http://ashleesimpsonfan.org/index.php ashleesimpsonfan.org] * [http://www.ashlee.de/gallery Multimedia site] (in German) * [http://ashleesimpson.wikicities.com Ashlee Simpson wiki] at Wikicities ; "Anti" sites * [http://www.lipsync.us lipsync.us] * [http://ashlee.zap.to ashlee.zap.to] * [http://www.thesmokinggun.com/archive/0408051_ashlee_simpson_1.html The Smoking Gun: ''Secret of Ashlee Simpson's Success''] ;''SNL'' incident videos: * [http://media.ebaumsworld.com/ashlee-snl.wmv WMV] * [http://www.lipsync.us/ashlee%20goofs.rm RealVideo] * [http://www.lipsync.us/ashlee_simpson_snl10232004.mpg MPEG] Female singers American actors American singers Pop singers Rock singers 1984 births Baptists People from Texas
Ashlee Simpson
Image:Ashlee_Couch.jpeg is this fair use? The photo on currently is a press photo for Jay Leno, but this looks like its by 17 Magazine or something. -- user:zanimum :I don't know what the status is, I didn't add it. It's from her album photoshoot, but since it isn't the album cover I don't know if it could be argued as fair use. User:Everyking 16:42, 27 Sep 2004 (UTC) :Bwahahah. I was watching SNL tonight and Ashlee Simpson came on for her first song and I was like "This girl cannot sing. This is going to suck." Then she sounded so perfect and I said "I'm telling you now, she's lip synching." And my friend said I was just hatin' on her. And then she comes out for the second number and fucks it all up! Fan-TASTIC! Loved it. User:Pacian 14:57, 24 Oct 2004 (UTC) ::Well, isn't that special. User:Everyking 15:08, 24 Oct 2004 (UTC) ::Dear teacup, here's your storm of the day. zzzzz User:GRAHAMUK This article is one-sided. How should I fix it? Adding another viewpoint didn't solve it. Am I suppose to just remove the unsupported statements and adjectives? Well, what? Do I need to actually make the removals to get anyone's help on this? Well, if nobody answers in 15 minutes, I'll make the edits and see if anyone has any help on this issue. :Tell me what isn't neutral, then. If I write that Ashlee is wonderful and you write in the next sentence that she's terrible, we certainly don't have Wikipedia:NPOV then, do we? Your edit was nothing but extremely hostile POV. Furthermore, I don't really know what more should be said about the SNL incident. I think what I've written covers it pretty well. User:Everyking 02:24, 28 Oct 2004 (UTC) It states: "although these are not uncommon techniques and have reportedly been used on SNL in the past.". There are no references or sources cited to back this up. It makes the incident misleading, giving the impression that other performers have attempted this, yet no evidence has been cited. :I could cite common knowledge, I suppose, but [http://news.yahoo.com/news?tmpl=story&u=/ap/20041024/ap_en_tv/people_ashlee_simpson_3 here], an AP story about the incident which mentions that. User:Everyking 02:30, 28 Oct 2004 (UTC) ::Please cite it then. Not everyone who reads the article knows about musical guests on a particular show. Seems suspicious though, an anonymous "insider". :::Fine, then, I cited it. Eventually Yahoo will take the article down, though, so it's only a temporary solution. And you can have all the suspicions you want; it's common knowledge that most singers use a guide vocal or lip sync on occasion, if not more frequently than that. Graham's point below is well taken, but it is being treated as notable so I suppose it deserves a reasonable level of detail. User:Everyking 02:39, 28 Oct 2004 (UTC) ::::Thank you. :::::If you watched the 60 minutes show, the producer clearly said that he has never seen anyone lip syncing in SNL. The statement: "although these are not uncommon techniques and have reportedly been used on SNL in the past." is unsupported and biased. The SNL incident should be written as it is. If it is a common knowledge that backing vocal tape is being used then there's no point of having it mentioned in the article at all isn't it? ::::::Thank you for registering your opinion. Everything in the article pertaining to the incident is just fine, however. User:Everyking 06:30, 22 Nov 2004 (UTC) :::::::Actually, there was a clip of Eminem on VH1 a week later on SNL who did the exact same thing on a much smaller scale. He could be heard singing when his lips weren't moving and his mic was down by his waist. There's your proof, there's your example. It's not hearsay or from an unknown source. It's something you can see firsthand, although the press didn't make a big deal out of it since Eminem is less outspoken about his image. User:Chiharu ''Furthermore, I don't really know what more should be said about the SNL incident'' Nothing MORE should be said about it. A lot LESS could be said about it. Christ, what a total storm in a teacup. Anyon ewould think this had some importance, or something. Why not just cut the whole section down to about one line? It's all it needs. User:GRAHAMUK 02:35, 28 Oct 2004 (UTC) ---- It says her age is 20, but I recall reading an AP story that cited her as 19, and in an SNL skit last night, they called her "not quite twenty". So, what's her age? User:TheCustomOfLife 01:40, Nov 1, 2004 (UTC) :She definitely turned 20 on October 3. I'm right, they're wrong. What's the AP worth when you've got Wikipedia? User:Everyking 02:30, 1 Nov 2004 (UTC) == Awards and Music sections == The music section is awfully large and, at the rate of User:Everyking prodigious editing, only going to grow further. I'd keep Awards separate. (Also, she could concievably get a nomination or award for her reality show or acting, or some sort of Razzie-type award for the SNL incident, or some Most Beautiful Person nod from a major publication, or so on...) User:Samaritan 14:58, 14 Dec 2004 (UTC) == Orange Bowl == Hey, this might be something to add. http://www.local10.com/entertainment/4048912/detail.html My dear Everyking, as abusive edit summaries are one of the lengthy charges listed against you in the current RfC, I would avoid making even more of them. Also, over 15,000 signatures in a mere 10 days is not "nonnotable", and certainly does something to balance out the "rah rah Ashlee" attitude that pervades this article. User:ReeneUser talk:Reene 08:41, Jan 15, 2005 (UTC) :My comment was referring to something as garbage. It was directed at the petition, not at the person who added it. And I submit that the petition is indeed nonnotable. It's the internet. It's probably 100 losers who have signed it again and again. I voted to delete the article on the "Gay Nigger Association of America", too. Trolling is almost always nonnotable, aside from a few general articles on the phenomenon. User:Everyking 08:52, 15 Jan 2005 (UTC) ::Something is not trolling simply because you disagree with it. Your comment, however, was abusive: "you've got some nerve, removing the quote while adding that nonnotable garbage." It is not the first time you have called an edit you did not like "garbage" or "nonsense" or what-have-you. And if you do indeed have proof that most or even half of those 15,000 signatures are made by the same person or group of people, please present it. User:ReeneUser talk:Reene 08:58, Jan 15, 2005 (UTC) I suppose I don't have proof, Reene. It looks like you've caught me. User:Everyking 09:01, 15 Jan 2005 (UTC) :If you had looked at the petition, each signature usually includes a quote or reason for signing. Duplicate signatures happen, but since a unique email address is required for each one and most people bothered to type out their unique reason for signing, I don't see how this petition could possibly have been signed by under 15,000 people (there are currently over 20,000 signatures). User:Silsor 19:30, Jan 15, 2005 (UTC) ==Early career information== Everyking, please explain this to me: how is the fact that Ashlee Simpson got her mouth washed out with soap and her Alanis album taken away at all encyclopedic, notable, or even interesting? ''This is not important.'' Neither is the fact that Ashlee Simpson jumped up on a bed and talked on a phone in a commercial -- aren't we talking about her career ''now'', not her career as a spokesgirl for Kohl's? I'm really at a loss here. Is all of the information in this article equally valuable? User:Madame Sosostris 22:06, 16 Jan 2005 (UTC) :Um, no, it's a biographical article, we're talking about her life in general. If you want an article just about the present period in her life, feel free to create one. User:Everyking 22:12, 16 Jan 2005 (UTC) ::The details of most public figures' childhoods are non-notable (with exceptions -- Michael Jackson, for instance, or perhaps Leopold von Sacher-Masoch). This ''is'' a biographical article, but the ''notable'' part of Ashlee's life is her career, not her upbringing. Most biographers spend far less time on their subjects' early lives, simply because most children do little that can be considered memorable. Just as an example, I've got Lord Blake's biography of Disraeli here, which clocks in at over seven hundred pages, and barely fifteen of those are spent on the years from birth until age seventeen. Even if she is a notable person, not every part of her life is important enough for inclusion in a general encyclopedia. Were we creating a fansite for teen idols, then these things would be more relevant. User:Madame Sosostris 22:38, 16 Jan 2005 (UTC) :::The Alanis/soap story is notable because she frequently tells it in interviews, and because it reflects on her early musical interests and influences. The Kohl's thing is notable because it was her first TV commercial. Both will be restored at the earliest available opportunity if they are removed. User:Everyking 23:06, 16 Jan 2005 (UTC) ::::I agree with Everyking on keeping those two pieces somewhere. The ad does help answer the question "how did she get onto TV anyway?" The Alanis thing should get a mention too. If it doesn't fit well into this article, it at least belongs in the influences section of the Autobiography album because stories like that are supposed to be the premise. User:IMeowbot~User talk:IMeowbot :::::I think you could cite Morrisette as an influence on the album, but I don't see why the whole story (with the soap and all) needs to be in there. A 'brief' mention of the commercial -- like, five words or so -- would be fine as well. Every word counts in these situations, and I think things ought to be as streamlined as possible, since these articles are already pretty damn big. User:Madame Sosostris 07:25, 17 Jan 2005 (UTC) ::::::Yep. I moved Alanis (sans soap) into Autobiography, and put in a reference to the YM article. I see that the ad is still mentioned in the current rev of this article. User:IMeowbot~User talk:IMeowbot 07:30, 17 Jan 2005 (UTC) == Discography == I've been checking out this article and the link to her album and I noticed that there are also articles linked from that page about her singles. I was curious if putting up some sort of Discography section on this page would not be helpful. Just a thought, but I worked out a preliminary one below so feel free to build on it or put it up, or let me know if I can! Thanks User talk:Cbing01 User:Cbing01 21:09, 17 Jan 2005 (UTC) :==Discography== :*''Pieces of Me'', single (music), June 29 2004 in music :*''Autobiography (Ashlee Simpson album)'', Album, July 20 2004 in music :*''Shadow (song)'', single, November 8 2004 in music (Australia), December 20 2004 in music (Europe) :*''La La (song)'', single, January 24 2005 in music (tentative) ::Yes, that's entirely consistent with the direction these article need to move. The occasional editor erroneously pushes for brevity at all costs, but the substantive issue is making sure that the articles are readable and genuinely informative. This is substance, not fluff, and matches what is done with other music articles, so I'll move it over. Thanks! User:IMeowbot~User talk:IMeowbot 23:01, 17 Jan 2005 (UTC) I no longer wish to edit this article or be actively involved in it. I may make occasional edits or updates, but I am withdrawing from active participation and removing it from my watchlist. User:Everyking 05:20, 18 Jan 2005 (UTC) I wanted to update some information on her tour, but apparently information on the tour is no longer available on anywhere on Wikipedia. I am baffled. Even User:Ambi told me I should add ''more'' info on her concerts, and you have removed it entirely? User:Everyking 02:02, 19 Jan 2005 (UTC) :The last sentence of Autobiography promotion and publicity notes the projected tour dates -- that's where I figured it belonged (since it falls under the heading of promotion). There wasn't much more information than that to begin with, as I recall. User:Madame Sosostris 07:20, 19 Jan 2005 (UTC) ::And that article will soon be deleted. Please change the start date to 2/16 from 2/18, as I am voluntarily barred from editing it per my agreement with Zen. User:Everyking 07:36, 19 Jan 2005 (UTC) :IMO, some info about tour(s) (as well as seriously notable specific shows) should go on Autobiography (Ashlee Simpson album), whereas a very short synopsis of the tour(s) should go on Ashlee Simpson and/or any other related articles as a bullet list or something similar. I personally have no objection to something like this being added; I can't speak for other editors though. User:ReeneUser talk:Reene 02:45, Jan 19, 2005 (UTC) ::Of course there's no information about the tour yet, because the tour is in the future. Wikipedia is not an advertising medium, nor is it a place to speculate on future events. For marketing and ticket sales, see http:;//ashleesimpsonmusic.com . User:IMeowbot~User talk:IMeowbot 03:04, 19 Jan 2005 (UTC) :::To be fair, I see events that have yet to happen being included in articles all the time. I myself have done so. I think there's something in the manual of style about it. Is there a problem with simply listing the start and finish date of the tour for now? User:ReeneUser talk:Reene 03:18, Jan 19, 2005 (UTC) :::If it stays extremely basic - country, opening date, closing month -- that would be reasonable. A list of anticipated venues would be crossing the line, though. Not only does that come across as ticket marketing, but those dates aren't all even final yet. Some venues are still subject to change depending on advance sales results, the length of the tour is still elastic, and acts and billing are still being negotiated. One interesting tidbit is about who is ''not'' running this tour. If this works out and anyone speaks on the record about why, that would be notable as part of a sea change. User:IMeowbot~User talk:IMeowbot 03:39, 19 Jan 2005 (UTC) ::::Well, you've got me curious, what do you mean? User:Everyking 06:16, 19 Jan 2005 (UTC) :::Just adding a bit in general here, that note about "on the record" is the reason why the Ashlee Simpson articles have seemed bloaty, and other music articles tend to be short. Pop performers' interviews are so heavily coached, and details like biographical information so heavily filtered through press offices, that they give wildly distorted versions of reality. The official history of some of those songs is hilarious, for example, given that some were shopped as demos well before Ashlee wrote them. The previous aborted album projects are also conspicuously missing. Simply put, official information isn't reliable. User:IMeowbot~User talk:IMeowbot 05:00, 19 Jan 2005 (UTC) == :Image:Tv jay leno guest ashley simpson.jpg == No fair use justification is given for this image, and it's not a screen shot. I'm going to make an actual screen grab from Leno to replace this. This photo can always go back later if an adequate justification can be made. User:IMeowbot~User talk:IMeowbot 22:22, 21 Jan 2005 (UTC) :Oh well, couldn't get a decent frame from the Leno broadcast (cameras only zoomed in when the mic was covering her face) but found a reasonable pose from the beginning of the Shadow video. We have a consistent policy for screen caps, so this should be okay. User:IMeowbot~User talk:IMeowbot 01:05, 22 Jan 2005 (UTC) ==Quotes== If you're looking for more quotes to add to the article, here's a good one from today's paper: :In a column in the Spokesman-Review on ghost hunting, Doug Clark ponders the popularity of Ashlee among the deceased: "Is Ashlee Simpson as annoying and talent-impared to the dead as she is to the living?" --User:Carnildo 03:32, 28 Jan 2005 (UTC) :We have a whole encyclopedia here to work on. I'm sure you can find something better to do than taking jabs at me. User:Everyking 03:39, 28 Jan 2005 (UTC) ::I don't think an insult to Ashlee Simpson constitutes a direct insult to you. Besides, there has been a higher incidence of anti-Ashlee quotes in the media of late; just yesterday I saw one (I think it was in the USA Today) that was even nastier than this. There may have to be a Backlash section before too long. User:Madame Sosostris 06:06, 28 Jan 2005 (UTC) Everyking, you really need to step back from this. If you think that somebody reporting an anti-Ashlee quote is an insult to ''you'', then it's clear that you've invested too much in her. User:RickKUser talk:RickK 06:30, Jan 28, 2005 (UTC) :Oh, come on. It was obviously intended to irritate me. User:Everyking 10:58, 28 Jan 2005 (UTC) The recently added image is not the cover of her album (perhaps in another country? I doubt it, but maybe). It's a picture from her album photo shoot, but it's not actually used in the album artwork. I don't know how we should label it, but currently it's not accurate. User:Everyking 11:08, 28 Jan 2005 (UTC) : :Image:Ashlee.jpg is a home-made picture. The text isn't properly anti-aliased, and it's Courier rather than the standard dot matrix logo. User:IMeowbot~User talk:IMeowbot 12:43, 28 Jan 2005 (UTC) Someone remove the petition from Ext. links. It's already in the text. Linking it twice is spamming. User:Everyking 15:26, 28 Jan 2005 (UTC) == Ha == Everyking, with [http://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=Ashlee_Simpson&diff=9752816&oldid=9752797 this edit] you appear to be removing facts and information. Your edit summary says 'trim some cruft'. Isn't this contrary to everything you've been arguing for? Or does your position only apply to things that you think make Simpson look better? User:Worldtraveller 19:52, 29 Jan 2005 (UTC) :No, it's consistent. My position has always been that there are some things that are too trivial or irrelevant for inclusion, and I think that level of detail about a trollish internet petition is excessive, at least for a biographical article on Ashlee Simpson. The fact of the petition is still recorded, but I placed it into better context. User:Everyking 20:11, 29 Jan 2005 (UTC) I think it's quite unfair to revert someone who's banned from reverting himself, Alkivar. It's not an even playing field. User:Everyking 01:48, 30 Jan 2005 (UTC) == SNL photo == I don't how long that SNL photo has said it was during a "rehearsal," but is there any proof of that? It seems unlikely to me. Why would she be so upset over a rehearsal? Would they have a boom microphone in a position like that for a rehearsal? Would they all be dressed the same way as they were during the show? What about the two guitar players - they look (to me) to be standing in the same positions they were during the actual performance, when they were on the main camera after she had walked away. User:Adam Bishop 01:55, 30 Jan 2005 (UTC) :She was wearing red during the actual performance, so logically it must be from the rehearsal. User:Everyking 01:57, 30 Jan 2005 (UTC) ::Hmm...you're right. Nuts. User:Adam Bishop 03:29, 30 Jan 2005 (UTC) ::Just for clarification: SNL dress rehearsals are produced as if they were the real show, so that the material can be substituted in rebroadcasts if the live show has problems. If the dress rehearsal performance had been completed, it probably would have been shown in the western US and in reruns instead of the mess seen live on the east coast. ::Before the show first aired, and SNL staffer did relate that the dress rehearsal went wrong. Marci was all set to get a substitute music act, but Joe insisted on doing the show, and the rest is... well. User:IMeowbot~User talk:IMeowbot 04:25, 31 Jan 2005 (UTC) Alkivar, the image should be right-aligned; that's standard and flows better with the text. Only left align in special cases. User:Everyking 04:19, 30 Jan 2005 (UTC) That is not notoriety! Reaction could be positive, in the form of sympathy, as easily as it could be negative. Please change it back, and cut out the redundant link again. User:Everyking 13:16, 1 Feb 2005 (UTC) :Why would I change it back? I made the edit because I think it improves the article. User:Worldtraveller 13:46, 1 Feb 2005 (UTC) ::Well yeah, but now you're supposed to see that you were wrong and change your mind about it. User:Everyking 16:59, 1 Feb 2005 (UTC) :Sorry, but I don't see that I was wrong. I don't see any evidence that the reaction to her lip-synching was anything other than overwhelmingly negative. User:Worldtraveller 17:24, 1 Feb 2005 (UTC) ::Then obviously you don't know what her fans think. Your version is highly POV and must be changed. User:Everyking 18:53, 1 Feb 2005 (UTC) == Merge of Ashlee Simpson on SNL == The result of the VfD on Ashlee Simpson on SNL was that it should be merged. The incident appears to me to already be thoroughly covered in the article, so I haven't added anything from [http://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=Ashlee_Simpson_on_SNL&oldid=9873316 Ashlee Simpson on SNL]. User:Dbenbenn | User talk:Dbenbenn 00:29, 2 Feb 2005 (UTC) :Yes. The idea behind having that article was to enable more detail to be written. Now we're stuck with what we've got. User:Everyking 00:49, 2 Feb 2005 (UTC) == "Backing tape" in the SNL incident== The references to a 'backing tape' in all of these articles need to be changed. Simpson's camp claims it was a backing tape she was going to sing along with; others claim it was a full-volume vocal track that she was going to lip-sync to (and that she was visibly miming during her first number). Calling it a 'backing tape' means supporting the former view (which seems to be the minority view among media commentators). User:68.118.61.219 05:18, 3 Feb 2005 (UTC) :Have it your way, then. You would know about neutrality better than me, after all: "Dpbsmith should put his findings on the Ashlee Simpson page in a paragraph on her declining reputation." User:Everyking 05:29, 3 Feb 2005 (UTC) ::That sounds fair, considering that is exactly what Dpbsmith's findings showed. -- User:Chuq 07:48, 3 Feb 2005 (UTC) :::This has all been analyzed to death. She did (try to) sing in the first song segment. There were two distinct copies of the lead vocal audible for the first several seconds, recorded and live. After that, the live vocal is cut off and it's only the recorded vocal (straight from the album). One of the channels had to go, because the two sounded bizarre, and the recording won. User:IMeowbot~User talk:IMeowbot 08:17, 3 Feb 2005 (UTC) I think including the petition figure is ridiculous. It's like me counting up all the posts on an Ashlee message board or something. The only point of having it is so people can point at it and say: Oh, look how many people don't like Ashlee! But it's deceptive, because it's probably a few hundred kids, maybe a few thousand. They don't deserve to have that kind of attention given to them—''maybe'' I'd accept it if others would accept some of the other things in the article that were removed for being "trivial", but which were in fact vastly more significant than that figure. It's a double standard, attaching more notability to anti-Ashlee information for no good reason. User:Everyking 08:40, 8 Feb 2005 (UTC) :I agree with Everyking's point about including the petition figure. IMO, not only are internet petitions pointless (and occasionally deceptive), but this is clearly POV (to me, anyway). I'd be willing to remove this paragraph not based on my knowledge of Ashlee Simpson, but simply based on my belief that internet petitions are pointless. --User:DeathphoenixUser_talk:Deathphoenix 14:51, 8 Feb 2005 (UTC) ---- On January 6, an Internet petition [http://www.petitiononline.com/StopAsh/petition.html] complaining about Simpson's singing was started. It accumulated nearly 300,000 signatures over the following weeks, making it among the most active of the site's petitions. [http://launch.yahoo.com/read/news/14285421] ---- :In fact, I decided to WP:BB and deleted the text above. I thought briefly about including the petition in the external links, but I don't think it's needed. Internet petitions are pointless anyways (or did I say that already?). --User:DeathphoenixUser_talk:Deathphoenix 15:10, 8 Feb 2005 (UTC) ::I decided to WP:BB and stuck it back in. I figure that any time people get worked up enough to collect 300,000 valid email addresses, it's worth mentioning. --User:Carnildo 19:02, 8 Feb 2005 (UTC) :::I respectfully disagree (but I won't WP:BB and remove it again (-:). It's very easy for people to bomb a petition with throwaway addresses. Being able to collect 300,000 valid email addresses could mean anything from 300,000 individual people actually signing the petition to one person signing 300,000 times under different identities. Of course, the answer is somewhere in between. But because of the wide variety of possible meanings, I don't see how including this piece of data is appropriate for an (online) encyclopedia. Strong reactions about Ashlee's singing? sure. But I don't see how an internet petition is a reliable source of information that can be used to demonstrate a point, because it can mean anything. --User:DeathphoenixUser_talk:Deathphoenix 20:36, 8 Feb 2005 (UTC) ::Seems to me it's worth mentioning, if it was one of the most popular on-line polls, but the number itself is not very important for the reasons Deathphoenix outlines. How about something like ''In January, an Internet petition at www.petitiononline.com [http://www.petitiononline.com/StopAsh/petition.html] complaining about Simpson's singing was among the most active of the site's petitions. [http://launch.yahoo.com/read/news/14285421]''? User:Worldtraveller 21:44, 8 Feb 2005 (UTC) :::I have no objection to either wording, but a link to the petition and the news article which mentions it should remain for verification purposes. I think having a number attached just requires us to keep updating it as the # of signatures increases. But simply based on the volume of signers (even if some of the entries are mickey mouse/donald duck/heywood jablome/etc...) Its much more likely that the real number of signers is going to outweigh the fakes, and as it did make the news its a noteworthy event. 23:20, 8 Feb 2005 (UTC) ::Yeah, I prefer User:Worldtraveller's version. "Most active of the site's petitions" is a good way to word it accurately. --User:DeathphoenixUser_talk:Deathphoenix 01:56, 9 Feb 2005 (UTC) :::Sounds good. --User:Carnildo 05:30, 9 Feb 2005 (UTC) ::::I changed the text to User:Worldtraveller's version. --User:DeathphoenixUser_talk:Deathphoenix 18:20, 3 Mar 2005 (UTC) ==Astroturfing== The "astroturfing" claim needs to be removed. There is apparently no evidence for it, and even if there was, it'd still be nonnotable. User:Everyking 06:56, 10 Feb 2005 (UTC) :Wrong. It is notable, and a few websites have linked to it and made a comment on it. - User:Ta bu shi da yu 06:58, 10 Feb 2005 (UTC) ::Wrong. A few websites linking to something does not make it notable. And I repeat that there appears to be no evidence. User:Everyking 07:05, 10 Feb 2005 (UTC) :::A few? You must be kidding. Try a google search of that phrase. Seems pretty damning to me! - User:Ta bu shi da yu 08:44, 10 Feb 2005 (UTC) :::The evidence seems pretty damning to me. Fifteen identical posts on message forums by the same username, said username only having the one post on each board? The same person making the exact same typo fifteen times? --User:Carnildo 07:17, 10 Feb 2005 (UTC) ::::Even Boing Boing has reported on it. 09:04, 10 Feb 2005 (UTC) This is weird. Maybe in my outrage I was not understood. Yes, there is ample evidence that posts were made. But where is the evidence that this was deliberate marketing my Simpson's people? In the first place, you need to attribute this claim, not state it as fact. User:Everyking 07:27, 11 Feb 2005 (UTC) :Want proof, here's proof... the posts in question were traced back to [http://www.guerillapr.com/ the firm responsible] by IP on several of the message boards, and up until the story broke on CNN (yes Guerilla advertising and this company in particular did hit CNN Headline News on Feb 7th) they proudly displayed that Geffen Records and Vivendi were customers. As of this moment in time they no longer show their connection. 08:22, 11 Feb 2005 (UTC) ::Could you provide a reference for this? --User:Carnildo 08:35, 11 Feb 2005 (UTC) :::For which part? 08:40, 11 Feb 2005 (UTC) ::::The IP trace. If there's an older version of the guerillapr.com page on the Internet Archive showing that Vivendi and Geffen were custormers, that would be nice as well. --User:Carnildo 08:43, 11 Feb 2005 (UTC) I liked Alkivar's edit summary. He should work to attribute the information in a NPOV manner instead of yelling at me. Blunt, unreferenced claims aren't acceptable. User:Everyking 08:53, 11 Feb 2005 (UTC) I hope TBSDY has a good explanation for that rollback. User:Everyking 12:28, 11 Feb 2005 (UTC) == Trying to make Ashlee Simpson look better is most definitely NOT npov == I object to this edit: [http://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=Ashlee_Simpson&diff=10160050&oldid=10160034]. It was changed from "Ashlee Simpson also later stated that she had acid reflux and her voice was apparently in such poor condition just hours before she was scheduled to perform—she may have had little choice but to rely heavily on the backing track." to "On the other hand, with her voice in such poor condition and given the importance of the show, she may have had little choice but to rely heavily on the backing track in that situation." I refuse to allow us to make Ashlee Simpson look better. That is not the point of an article: we state facts and we don't try to make people look better than they are. Hence I've rolled back and made an edit to fixup some text I was going to copyedit anyway. - User:Ta bu shi da yu 12:30, 11 Feb 2005 (UTC) :Rollback is designed to be used against vandalism, not in content disputes. User:Everyking 12:31, 11 Feb 2005 (UTC) ::Fine. It won't happen again. - User:Ta bu shi da yu 12:36, 11 Feb 2005 (UTC) I also object to you saying I'm trying to make her look better. My only goal is neutrality. I presume that's your goal, too, so we shouldn't have any need for dispute. User:Everyking 12:38, 11 Feb 2005 (UTC) :That was your edit? I didn't know that when I edited the article. I merely removed some weasel words (some people called her a hypocrite - who exactly?) and some text that appears to try to position Wikipedia into a justification of the whole incident. - User:Ta bu shi da yu 12:40, 11 Feb 2005 (UTC) An open question: should the "astroturfing" claims be in their own section, or rather in another, larger section, such as "controversies" or "in 2005"? User:Everyking 13:29, 11 Feb 2005 (UTC) :Personally, I agree with your edit of putting it into 2005. Works better with the flow. I wouldn't oppose you if you put it back the way it was. - User:Ta bu shi da yu 13:40, 11 Feb 2005 (UTC) One SNL video is more than enough. User:Everyking 21:58, 12 Feb 2005 (UTC) :I would also agree with this. - User:Ta bu shi da yu 10:00, 13 Feb 2005 (UTC) ::Its two different formats, I think its acceptable to have 2 links in this case. Its not a matter of being overly anti ashlee in this case. 10:10, 13 Feb 2005 (UTC) :::Oh. I wasn't aware of this. In that case, I agree with Alkivar. - User:Ta bu shi da yu 10:29, 13 Feb 2005 (UTC) Wikipedia is not a library for video clips. User:Everyking 11:57, 13 Feb 2005 (UTC) :When the videos are related to the topic, it is perfectly fine to have links to the clips. - User:Ta bu shi da yu 12:51, 13 Feb 2005 (UTC) ::This is advertising for lipsync.us. Tell you what. We can have the clips linked in the ext. links section, not in the text, but in exchange we get to remove the main lipsync.us link. User:Everyking 13:21, 13 Feb 2005 (UTC) :::If you have a problem with using lipsync.us, find the video in the alternative formats and post a link to them instead. The only steady easy to find versions I found were the ones on lipsync. 14:24, 13 Feb 2005 (UTC) ::::They will all be gone in a few months anyway. I try to think of Wikipedia over the long term. User:Everyking 14:26, 13 Feb 2005 (UTC) :::::So do I, whenever Jimbo gets off his butt and picks a definative video format for commons, I will get someone to reencode this (since LipSync.US has given permission) and upload it there. 14:54, 13 Feb 2005 (UTC) ::::::Well permission for their copy anyway, its still a fair use since SNL owns the actual copyright. 14:55, 13 Feb 2005 (UTC) :::::::I don't see how that would be fair use any more than all her other TV appearances would be fair use in video form. User:Everyking 16:55, 13 Feb 2005 (UTC) ::::::::It's fair use because it is "for purposes such as criticism, comment, news reporting, teaching (including multiple copies for classroom use), scholarship, or research", its presentation on Wikipedia is of a non-commercial, educational nature, the portion excerpted is small relative to the original work (i.e. the entire SNL broadcast that night), and there is no effect on the market value of the original work. (That episode of SNL is *not* available for purchase, to my knowledge.) User:Skyraider 17:35, 13 Feb 2005 (UTC) I suppose that applies to all her TV appearances, then? User:Everyking 17:56, 13 Feb 2005 (UTC) :It could. It really depends on how they're used. (Fair warning:IANAL.) User:Skyraider 19:27, 13 Feb 2005 (UTC) ::Yeah, I don't think that's right. User:Everyking 19:53, 13 Feb 2005 (UTC) :::Any copyrighted work *could* be used in a "fair use" manner in a subsequent work. Whether a specific use constitutes fair use is determined by the courts, but the law lays out explicitly what factors are to be considered in making that determination. The nature of the original and subsequent works and the manner of use are key factors. (Fair use is an excellent article, IMO.) User:Skyraider 20:46, 13 Feb 2005 (UTC) ==POV pushing== Everyking's recent edit summary: ''summarize a little...we deleted the article on the tour and this is not 1% as notable as that''. Everyking, you only ever want to 'summarise' or 'trim' things that are not favourable to Simpson. It's really irritating to see such flagrant pushing of a POV. The VfD on the tour article does not entitle you to some kind of quid pro quo removal of information which casts her in a bad light. Pop groups tour all the time - underhand publicity techniques are somewhat less common, so what makes you think a tour is 100 times as notable? User:Worldtraveller 23:17, 2 Mar 2005 (UTC) :Oh, is this about the BBS spamming thing? It's extremely common nowadays, used for virtually all new major label acts. That's part of the so-called viral marketing that companies like Fanscape, Fanpimp etc. perform in addition to the more visible "street team" stuff. --User:IMeowbot~User talk:IMeowbot 00:58, 3 Mar 2005 (UTC) ::It's also usually a violation of "terms of use" agreements on the forums where it occurs. User:24.195.17.40 17:32, 9 Mar 2005 (UTC) ::: Okay, then an article about the marketing practice might be useful, or perhaps a discussion of it under one of the existing spam articles. To dig up the relevant postings bring it up in the article for each and every current music act would be serious overkill, bordering on spam itself, though. --User:IMeowbot~User talk:IMeowbot 23:23, 9 Mar 2005 (UTC) ==Photo Queue== I'm sure there are plenty of good photographs for the article. However I removed this one for the moment since 1) we already have a photo from her tv show 2) this sorta clutters up the section around the discography since there is already another photo there. I personally recommend not readding this one, but thats up to a consensus. 06:57, 11 Mar 2005 (UTC) :It could do with a better caption if it is re-inserted. User:TheCustomOfLife 07:00, Mar 11, 2005 (UTC) Presumably the section will grow and then it can be readded? User:Everyking 07:03, 11 Mar 2005 (UTC) :I have no objection to another photo in that section once its expanded, however I personally would prefer a different image not a 2nd image from her TV show (just for varieties sake). 07:06, 11 Mar 2005 (UTC) ::Well, I think screenshots are considered free from copyright issues, whereas most everything else isn't. User:Everyking 07:22, 11 Mar 2005 (UTC) :::No screenshots are not "free from copyright issues", however they are "fair use", the problem of course becomes that Jimbo eventually plans on removing "fair use" images, and that "fair use" images arent commercially useable which goes against the whole GFDL'd encyclopedia concept. 07:26, 11 Mar 2005 (UTC) ::::I don't know about all those legal matters, but the point stands that screenshots can apparently be used before most other things can. User:Everyking 07:30, 11 Mar 2005 (UTC) =="Trivia"== Is this: :As a guest on a European television show she participated in a "Keepin' it Real" segment where she was tested on common knowledge. She was unable to state the cost of a carton of milk, nor could she name the capital of Spain or what the employment position of Condoleeza Rice was. This was featured in episode eight of season two of The Ashlee Simpson Show. ...notable enough for inclusion? I think it could be worth a mention in the article on the reality show, but not here. If you agree, feel free to remove it, because I'm not allowed to. User:Everyking 12:13, 18 Mar 2005 (UTC) ::Trivia sections in general are frowned upon, we're supposed to find a way to work it into the article itself. Perhaps this would be decent comparison material versus her "intelligent" chicken of the sea sister? 15:38, 18 Mar 2005 (UTC) :::No, I don't really see how it has any place in the article at all. User:Everyking 16:27, 18 Mar 2005 (UTC) ::::Thats because you never see a reason to include any negative information. 16:58, 18 Mar 2005 (UTC) :::::It was on the show; if it was so negative, I don't suppose they would've shown it on the show. My only point is that it's too trivial for this article, but might have a place on the TASS article. User:Everyking 17:27, 18 Mar 2005 (UTC) ::::::Since I was the person who added it, I guess I'll defend it. Considering that she has accomplished relatively little in terms of famous entertainers, I'd be hard pressed to understand how this information is any more or less trivial than any of the other minutea mentioned within the article. Ashlee simpson, by and large, is hardly a person of great accomplishment. That being said, I think the information is important in establishing exactly what kind of a person Ashlee Simpson is; IE, one who is relatively removed from "real life," and not very educated. There is no reason why a person who is successful enough to be in the public eye should not have achieved enough of a level of education or personal knowledge to know who Condoleeza Rice is. It speaks volumes about who Ashlee Simpson is as a person. I fully support removal of a "trivia" section, but I don't think it would be appropriate to remove the information completely. User:Pacian 06:44, 19 Mar 2005 (UTC) I tell you, if I tried to add some comparable level of trivia, it'd be removed within an hour. But I wouldn't even ''want'' to. User:Everyking 13:30, 19 Mar 2005 (UTC) Any idea what [http://www.livejournal.com/community/ashleesimpson/243587.html these people] are talking about, about some picture that's disgusting? They seem to be saying the article was vandalized with an image, but in the history I see no vandalism at the time when they would have been looking at the page...I see no image vandalism at any time, anyway. User:Everyking 14:45, 21 Mar 2005 (UTC) :Image poison vandalism... the album cover was changed to Goatse guy. It's been reverted. 15:00, 21 Mar 2005 (UTC) ::I should be more specific, someone renamed it to the same as the album cover and uploaded it in its place, they did not alter the article itself. 15:01, 21 Mar 2005 (UTC) :::Ah, I always lack imagination when I try to figure out vandals. User:Everyking 17:28, 21 Mar 2005 (UTC) It's generally difficult to find out a place of birth definitively, short of a statement by the person him/herself. Jessica's place of birth was given wrongly for years; it's even stated wrongly on her own website. For that reason I've never added a place of birth to this article, no matter if there's a statement from the label on the website or not. My personal preference would be not to include it without something more conclusive. Coming at the very beginning of the article makes it very important to get it right. User:Everyking 16:46, 28 Mar 2005 (UTC) : Given that the Simpson press kits and releases have all been consistent about this detail, it can stand, unless ''all'' information that has been released through Geffen is to be retracted as suspect. --User:IMeowbot~User talk:IMeowbot 16:56, 28 Mar 2005 (UTC) ::I would rather wait to hear her mention her birthplace, or one of her family, since I'm a stickler for accuracy above all else. But if you disagree, of course I am powerless to do anything about it, so I guess that's that. User:Everyking 17:03, 28 Mar 2005 (UTC) :::It looks like her birthplace was either Dallas or Waco. Given the history of Waco, my guess is she would say Dallas regardless. I guess it doesn't really matter either way. You could say "in or near Dallas" if it matters that much. -- 17:38, 28 Mar 2005 (UTC) ::::Given that the only hospital I can find in Waco (via google search) is a Veterans Affairs hospital, unless she was born via Midwife at home, she was likely born in one of the 14 hospitals in the Dallas Metro area (a mere hours drive away.) ALKIVAR">User:Alkivar™ 18:55, 28 Mar 2005 (UTC) :::::I made the change to from Waco to Dallas. Her [http://www.imdb.com/name/nm1249883/ IMDB profile] indicates that to be her birthplace, and sites like [http://dallas.about.com/od/localcelebrityprofiles/p/ashleesimpson.htm this] and [http://www.biogs.com/famous/simpsonashlee.html this] agree. I've seen some that state her birthplace as Waco, but from what I can see, a lot of them are actually Wikipedia mirrors. --User:DeathphoenixUser_talk:Deathphoenix 05:58, 9 Apr 2005 (UTC) ==Dead links== Two of the external links, for the fan site and the associated pictures site, have gone dead, and at present it's unclear if they will ever be back, so I figure we should remove them for the time being (I'm sure User:IMeowbot knows why they are down, but I don't). At the same time, however, if we don't have a fan site to link to, we shouldn't link to lipsync.us either, so we should remove that link for balance. User:Everyking 10:05, 5 Apr 2005 (UTC) :Just stick in a link to a different fan site. There's tons of those things. Somebody revert the anon edit, please. User:Everyking 06:42, 9 Apr 2005 (UTC) :Done. ALKIVAR">User:Alkivar™ 06:50, 9 Apr 2005 (UTC) Either Pacian's recent paragraph should be cited and demonstrated to be in some way notable, or it should be removed. User:Everyking 05:43, 10 Apr 2005 (UTC) : I don't like you very much, Everyking, and I have to be honest, I don't think you're a very good Wikipedian. I'd like to inform you, in case you didn't already know, that the users of this website are in fact human persons. I understand that you feel the need to be blunt and use candor about your opinion, but does it actually cause you some kind of physical pain to be polite to others? You seem to have a wicked habit of stating your opinion without actually stating it, and then making it sound like it's the ONLY correct opinion (all the while ignoring the potential effect it may have on others and their feelings.) For instance, above, you are basically saying "Pacian's recent paragraph is not notable, and it should be removed." Well, I happen to disagree, and you don't get to definitively decide what is notable and what is not, sir. It is NOTABLE because for a celebrity to potentially offer an indirect endoresment of a product that is in direct competition with a product they are paid to represent could result in millions of dollars of legal damages, and though it is a developing incident, it is none the less completely legit. As a citation, why not visiting The Smoking Gun (the very website I - GASP - cited!) In all seriousness, you need to start thinking about people's feelings. You don't have to kiss butt, but you could TRY to phrase things more politely and considerately. User:Pacian 06:02, 10 Apr 2005 (UTC) ::I'm sorry that you don't like me. I have no particular opinion about you. I am aware of the Smoking Gun link. However, where is the cite for this claim that chewing some other kind of gum could produce some big controversy? Personal speculation isn't notable. If you ask me, if she's just quietly chewing the gum in her dressing room, that wouldn't rationally seem to contradict any contracts, anyway. I don't know who made those papers public, but it certainly wasn't her or her management. So this stuff should be cited. And before it even needs to be included at all, there should be a demonstration of notability. The Smoking Gun thing is arguably very, very marginally notable. But speculation about one particular aspect of it? I think there should be a demonstration of notability for that. User:Everyking 06:10, 10 Apr 2005 (UTC) :::Drudge reported there is a lawsuit pending. Its relevant. ALKIVAR">User:Alkivar™ 06:19, 10 Apr 2005 (UTC) ::::If you can give a cite, then the paragraph (appropriately modified) can go back in. --User:Carnildo 06:22, 10 Apr 2005 (UTC) ::::If there really is a lawsuit pending, OK, that'd make it notable. But where's a cite to show that a lawsuit is indeed pending? User:Everyking 06:23, 10 Apr 2005 (UTC) :::::The specific page of the smoking gun site in question about the gum is [http://www.thesmokinggun.com/archive/0408051_ashlee_simpson_9.html page 9]. The question I have, is should the paragraph mention the fact that the documents state the drummer is responsible for "pre-recorded sequences" even tho she swears she doesnt use them? Thats on [http://www.thesmokinggun.com/archive/0408051_ashlee_simpson_2.html page 2]. I happen to find that more controversial. I cant seem to find the link on drudge that was on there earlier today. ALKIVAR">User:Alkivar™ 06:35, 10 Apr 2005 (UTC) ::::::That wording was a little odd. It says that the "orchestration" includes pre-recorded sequences. Does this "orchestration" include Ashlee? Pre-recorded sequences could be background sound effects, like what someone would normally play on a synthesizer. --brian0918">User:Brian0918™">User talk:Brian0918 06:37, 10 Apr 2005 (UTC) ::::::::I would assume it's various intrumentation they can't properly duplicate with the band. I think that's common. User:Everyking 06:40, 10 Apr 2005 (UTC) :I've removed the paragraph. The "Smoking Gun" link is just a set of scans (or maybe transcriptions) of Ashlee's requirements for performing; any claims of controversy based on that would be original research. --User:Carnildo 06:22, 10 Apr 2005 (UTC) Alkivar's edit directly claims that the prerecorded sequences are vocal. This is highly unlikely to be true and there is no evidence to support it. User:Everyking 06:43, 10 Apr 2005 (UTC) :I'm sorry if thats the way you took it, feel free to specify a better wording. I did not mean to imply it was necessarily vocal oriented. I think they happened to pick deliberately overbroad wording with "pre-recorded sequences" so as to potentially include vocals. ALKIVAR">User:Alkivar™ 06:45, 10 Apr 2005 (UTC) ::Your edit claims she contradicted herself. That's not true. She only said she wasn't using any vocal guide tracks. That's not the same thing at all. User:Everyking 06:49, 10 Apr 2005 (UTC) :::I have since tried to clarify my statement, is this better? ALKIVAR">User:Alkivar™ 06:50, 10 Apr 2005 (UTC) ::::It still falsely accuses her of contradicting herself, drawing a false connection between what she said about guide vocals and the possible use of recorded instrumentation sequences. She did not deny the use of the latter. User:Everyking 06:55, 10 Apr 2005 (UTC) :::::Suggest a specific wording then. I'll be happy to change it, I just think it should be included. ALKIVAR">User:Alkivar™ 07:01, 10 Apr 2005 (UTC) ::::::Just remove the quote, and don't suggest there's a contradiction. User:Everyking 07:02, 10 Apr 2005 (UTC) :::::::You should probably not be posting here, it looks like it violates your arbcom ruling. The only way I could see you getting around it is to talk on user pages, and not use her name specifically, but I wouldn't suggest trying to get around arbcom rulings, they might not like that. --brian0918">User:Brian0918™">User talk:Brian0918 07:04, 10 Apr 2005 (UTC) ::::::::What on earth would make you think the ruling applies to talk pages? Rulings hardly ever apply to talk pages. User:Everyking 07:05, 10 Apr 2005 (UTC) :::::::::Nevermind. --brian0918">User:Brian0918™">User talk:Brian0918 07:10, 10 Apr 2005 (UTC) ::::::::That's silly. It specifically says "article". User:Silsor 07:07, Apr 10, 2005 (UTC) :::::::::It seems to me what it says quite plainly is that he is not allowed to edit articles and that, in fact, the only participation allowed is if he sees vandalism in progress (and if so he is expected to report that to someone else so that they can make the correction.) In other words, coming to a talk page to state that something within the article doesn't belong is *NOT* tantamount to reporting vandalism to an appropriate party. Using a talk page to attempt to get changes made that you would make on your own, if you could, is just an attempt at bypassing the fact that you have been instructed not to make changes. User:Pacian 07:17, 10 Apr 2005 (UTC) :::::::::::What it says quite plainly is that I cannot edit articles. Which means I can edit talk pages to my heart's content. User:Everyking 07:24, 10 Apr 2005 (UTC) ::::::::::::You could try contributing something meaningful to the encyclopedia. --brian0918">User:Brian0918™">User talk:Brian0918 07:27, 10 Apr 2005 (UTC) :::::::::::::I make at least 100-150 edits on an average day, and I have a featured article to my credit, so I must be doing something meaningful. User:Everyking 07:30, 10 Apr 2005 (UTC) ::::::::::::::See my comment above. --brian0918">User:Brian0918™">User talk:Brian0918 07:35, 10 Apr 2005 (UTC) :::::::::::::::Maybe you don't think my work's been meaningful, but I can just about guarantee you that I've done a lot more than you have. User:Everyking 07:37, 10 Apr 2005 (UTC) ::::::::::::::::My suggestion was for your future work over the next year. It'd be more meaningful to write new articles than to fix spelling errors and bicker 24/7 on Ashlee Simpson talk pages. You may have more edits, but I guarantee that my edits are more meaningful to the encyclopedia. :) brian0918">User:Brian0918™">User talk:Brian0918 07:41, 10 Apr 2005 (UTC) :::::::::::::::::And I have written new articles recently, for instance: Central African Republic elections, 2005, Togo presidential election, 2005, Liberia elections, 2005 (maybe others I'm forgetting), not to mention expanding lots of other articles. But why am I justifying any of my work to you? User:Everyking 07:47, 10 Apr 2005 (UTC) ::::::::::::::::::Not sure. --brian0918">User:Brian0918™">User talk:Brian0918 07:50, 10 Apr 2005 (UTC) ::::::::::::::Just curious, Everyking--since Wikipedia articles are a community effort and nobody owns them, how do you have a featured article to "your" credit? User:24.195.27.248 00:46, 14 Apr 2005 (UTC) :::::::::::::::Because I wrote it. What does that have to do with owning it? User:Everyking 08:20, 14 Apr 2005 (UTC) ==Removed speculation== :''On April 09, 2005, The Smoking Gun posted one of Simpson's concert riders. In it she demands that either Dentyne or Orbit (gum) gum be provided at her venue. This has caused a conflict with her paid commercial endorsement of Liquid Ice mints and gum, part of the Ice Breakers mint and gum line. Ice Breakers are a product of Hershey corporation, while Dentyne is made by Cadbury and Orbit is made by Wrigley. Aligning herself in any fashion with mint or gum products made by the competitors of the company for whom she is a paid commercial endorser is cause for major legal action, though whether anything will come of it remains to be seen. Also of note in this report is a mention of "pre-recorded sequences" which could potentially include vocals, something Simpson claims to have stopped using as recently as April 8 in a Sun-Sentinel.com interview by Jon Bream regarding her Florida tour leg: "'There will be no backing vocal tracks at all,' Ashlee Simpson said of her current tour". [http://www.sun-sentinel.com/features/lifestyle/sfl-liashleeapr09,0,5159381.story]'' Without a cite for a lawsuit or threat thereof, this paragraph feels like original research. If you wish to re-insert it, please provide a citation. And please stop editing this page so fast -- I can't get a word in endwise! --User:Carnildo 07:45, 10 Apr 2005 (UTC) :I'm fine with it. Alkivar now says he may have been wrong about the lawsuit. --brian0918">User:Brian0918™">User talk:Brian0918 07:48, 10 Apr 2005 (UTC) Someone edit the anon addition--her career does not need "saving", least of all by an internet petition, which are not taken seriously by anyone whether they are for or against her. User:Everyking 17:50, 10 Jun 2005 (UTC) :Done. I've removed the sentence and link to the "Save Ashlee" petition. --User:DeathphoenixUser_talk:Deathphoenix 19:51, 10 Jun 2005 (UTC) == Why does this article exist at all? == Guys, Given the level of acrimony I'm seeing here between her supporters and critics, I have to ask whether you don't all have something better to do? Ten years from now, she'll be forgotten just like the Bay City Rollers, Menudo, and the New Kids on the Block. Leave this subject for the tabloids. :What? You don't want an article on Menudo? User:Everyking 04:37, 18 Apr 2005 (UTC) ::I think as long as it's a topic is fairly notable, someone some where in the world would find its entry helpful. When articles start popping up about the World's biggest cheeto, that's where we might want to start drawing the line. :::You're kidding me. We don't have an article on the world's biggest cheeto yet? User:Everyking 04:54, 18 Apr 2005 (UTC) ::::If you're going to have articles on the likes of Ashlee Simpson and Menudo, then there should probably be a category for pseudo-musicians; products of marketing departments, lip-sync coaches, choreographers, plastic surgeons, and publicity agents. Whatever these people are, they're NOT musicians. :::::There's an article on Milli Vanilli, if that's what you're looking for. --User:Carnildo 22:19, 18 Apr 2005 (UTC) :::::Yeah, because we decide whether or not people should have articles based on whether they suit your personal taste. User:Everyking 22:23, 18 Apr 2005 (UTC) :::::: It's not a matter of taste, it's a matter of significance. I have no use for Jackson Pollock at all, but he is significant for founding the P.T. Barnum mode of selling so-called artwork. This little ditz will be throughly forgotten in another year, tops. :::::::That's possible. But irrelevant. She's very famous. User:Everyking 17:45, 20 Apr 2005 (UTC) ::::::::And how much more famous has she become because of you, sir? --User:Newnoise 20:48, 22 Apr 2005 (UTC) :::::::::I can't imagine an increased familiarity among a few Wikipedia editors compares to millions of albums sold, millions of TV viewers, and dozens of sold out concerts. But if you want to credit me with that kind of influence in the world, hey, I don't mind. User:Everyking 20:52, 22 Apr 2005 (UTC) There's a paragraph about the Punk'd episode I wrote on the Wikicity project. Someone could add that here, perhaps with less detail. User:Everyking 21:19, 25 Apr 2005 (UTC) Someone please improve the Punk'd paragraph that an anon added. My suggestion is something along these lines, possibly in abbreviated form: :On April 24, 2005, she appeared in an episode of the MTV celebrity prank show Punk'd. She was the subject of a prank in which she was set up to think that her jacket had caught on fire due to being placed near a candle, causing the overhead sprinklers in the art museum she was in to go off, thus ruining the paintings in the room. She became upset when confronted about it, but then laughed and was playfully angry when the prank was revealed to her by the show's host, Ashton Kutcher. User:Everyking 22:21, 29 Apr 2005 (UTC) Somebody please revert the anon. It is vandalism but maybe not quite blatant enough for me to be able to get away with reverting it. User:Everyking 23:12, 16 May 2005 (UTC) :Definitely vandalism, but I think you did the right thing by not reverting it yourself. User:Rhobite 23:16, May 16, 2005 (UTC) I don't understand the anon's edit. More tears? Where's the first mention of tears? User:Everyking 22:41, 6 Jun 2005 (UTC) :Agreed. Plus the awkwardness of "reduced into" vs. "reduced to" and the passive voice of "Ashlee Simpson was reduced. . ." Cleaned it up to what I hope is a generally acceptable version. User:Skyraider 16:55, 9 Jun 2005 (UTC) ::Yeah, that contributor is sort of odd. All of his contributions seem to be about celebrities who appeared on Punk'd. Most of his sentences are awkward, maybe he's a kid. I agree that "reduced into tears" is a strange way of putting it. Don't know why he keeps reverting to his version of the sentence. User:Rhobite 20:03, Jun 10, 2005 (UTC) ==Ext links== In my opinion the ext. links section is a bit bloated and could use some trimming. Any thoughts on what (if anything) we could remove? User:Everyking 03:29, 23 Jun 2005 (UTC) :A subject near and dear to my heart. Is there a directory of fan sites that could replace the separate fan site links? Also, I don't think we need the SNL incident in three formats. Unless the MPEG one is of significantly lower quality, I think having just that one will suffice (MPEG is the nearest to a "free" format of the three, and also has the widest compatibility). --User:Weyes(User talk:Weyes) 03:33, 2005 Jun 23 (UTC)
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